Obvious common sense policy for Britain

[darmstadt]

There are many UK based IT contractors making a very good living out of working in a borderless EU. The fact that UK contractors can and do work all over the EU enriches the market for those who work in it. So my point is that instead of denying there is a problem and accusing those of us who want to close down the numbers of immigrants coming to the UK of being racist "little englanders" and coming out with your ridiculous scaremongering it would be rather refreshing if you would simply admit to your own self interest. The same applies to those of us who do not like the UK being part of the European Union.

so doesn't actually apply to me which means you can take out the highlighted crap

[Batcher]

That's uncalled for

Je Suis FatLazyContractor

[vetran]

The hard working Eastern Eurpoeans are paying tax which, in turn, is paying the pensions of those ex-pats living in Spain and elsewhere. The pensioners aren't getting benefits from the Spanish and are not self funding.

If pensions had been set up correctly in the first place, the money you put in would be kept in a pot for you retiring but it wasn't so the workers of today are paying the pensioners and they, in turn, will need to rely on the workers of the future to pay their pensions.

and those expats in Spain paid tax which paid for the war and the pension who went before, I wish people would stop attacking pensioners they worked as well. The fact previous governments spent their contributions is not their fault.

[Batcher]

and those expats in Spain paid tax which paid for the war and the pension who went before, I wish people would stop attacking pensioners they worked as well. The fact previous governments spent their contributions is not their fault.

I'm not attacking them, just pointing out that their pensions are paid for by present day workers. If those workers are forced to go back to Eastern Europe and the pensioners to come back here then there would be a deficit as the pensions would still need to be paid with less tax coming in.

[Euler]

I'm not attacking them, just pointing out that their pensions are paid for by present day workers. If those workers are forced to go back to Eastern Europe and the pensioners to come back here then there would be a deficit as the pensions would still need to be paid with less tax coming in.

No one will force the pensioners to come back - its just that the reciprocal arrangements won't necessarily apply so they'll have to pay more for services they are used to - which will make it impossible for many to stay.

[vetran]

I'm not attacking them, just pointing out that their pensions are paid for by present day workers. If those workers are forced to go back to Eastern Europe and the pensioners to come back here then there would be a deficit as the pensions would still need to be paid with less tax coming in.

maybe as we could get 25,000 accession country 'workers' off JSA and probably another 10,000 traditional EU and as most of the low paid workers will be on tax credits the removal of a large portion of the workforce should drive wages up so supermarkets have to pay a living wage taking them out of tax credits.

Also as many of these pensioners probably have private pensions they would be paying tax in the UK.

it may not be as bad as it looks.

[Batcher]

No one will force the pensioners to come back - its just that the reciprocal arrangements won't necessarily apply so they'll have to pay more for services they are used to - which will make it impossible for many to stay.

Yes, I'm agreeing with that. So if they take ill they either have to go private in Spain or fly home to the NHS. Most will just move back here I would imagine.

[Euler]

The NHS needs to be broken before people realise it needs reform- hopefully that will do it!

[Batcher]

maybe as we could get 25,000 accession country 'workers' off JSA and probably another 10,000 traditional EU and as most of the low paid workers will be on tax credits the removal of a large portion of the workforce should drive wages up so supermarkets have to pay a living wage taking them out of tax credits.

Also as many of these pensioners probably have private pensions they would be paying tax in the UK.

it may not be as bad as it looks.

You must be mad if you think employers will put up wages. It's a race to the bottom and once low they will rarely come back up. Same as if you accept a contract for £100 a day then try to get it up to £150. They will just look for someone else willing to do it for £90.

[d000hg]

as there hasn't been a mass starvation (foodbanks seem to be suffering from poorly applied benefit sanctions and failure to issue the correct benefits or incredibly low wages) it seems we didn't need to spend it to eat.

now I'm prepared to believe some of the cuts could have been applied more sympathetically by those implementing them but overall they have been for the good.

I would agree with you that the issue has primarily been implementation and heavy-handed generalisation, and that the theory of the cuts was good. However the problem is that when you cock up the implementation of something like JSA, the consequences are pretty bad so implementation is pretty crucial

Not sure that the public being willing to rally round and prop up a failing public service should be seen as evidence it was doing OK. If they cut benefits altogether you'd probably see a massive increase in foodbanks, soup kitchens, etc from a whole range of charitable and church groups to take the strain but that's effectively the government passing the cost onto the public.