Ed Miliband’s pledges

[Gibbon]

As a populace we are too "welded" to the welfare state, NHS and socialist institutions to want to change. The coalition have done wonders to get us all back to work. The fact that we are not earning enough is because we are not ambitious or hard working enough and too dishonest to blame ourselves

There is a lot of truth in that, also there is a fallacy that education is to blame. Lack of work ethic and can do attitude are a lot more to blame. Neither I or my better-half hold a degree level qualification but we have a joint household income well in excess of 150K. Both of us left school at 16 with a clutch of 'O' levels. However we are targets of envy amongst some relatives as its 'alright for us as we have lots of money'. Yet they wouldn't work away from home at times, feel comfortable on short volatile contracts or in my wife's case take on huge responsibilities heading up a 800 strong workforce.

[lilelvis2000]

Hence why the EU migrants win the jobs and not the local populace. EU migrants don't come here for freebies - so all this "we will prevent benefit tourism" is just electioneering. If there is any tourism going on, it will be tiny. But its a fantastic way to cover up the real problem. UK dependency on very very cheap labour, rather than productive skilled labour. Lack of investment in improved processes etc..

The economy might improve in a kind of coughing and spluttering way (especially in the forgotten hinterlands of the north) but no more improvement will be seen for a long time.

[d000hg]

There is a lot of truth in that, also there is a fallacy that education is to blame. Lack of work ethic and can do attitude are a lot more to blame. Neither I or my better-half hold a degree level qualification but we have a joint household income well in excess of 150K. Both of us left school at 16 with a clutch of 'O' levels. However we are targets of envy amongst some relatives as its 'alright for us as we have lots of money'. Yet they wouldn't work away from home at times, feel comfortable on short volatile contracts or in my wife's case take on huge responsibilities heading up a 800 strong workforce.

But where did you get your work ethic from? Parental influence or something that's inherently part of who you are?

[ZARDOZ]

You are a miserable ungrateful unappreciating little leftie. The current coalition have done wonders to achieve a turnaround in the economy without resorting to Thatcherite policies

The "turnaround in the economy" was from another little Brownite style housing boom created by oiling the banks with public debt and artificially fixing interest rates. What could possibly go wrong with that?
You can tell this is a fake recovery when you consider Italy has a higher level of productivity than the UK.
In real terms this housing bubble has made those with savings and fixed incomes, e.g. pensioners poorer. In the meantime the national debt is at record levels and increasing every day. There is no miracle about what they have done, just more of the same boom to bust and passing forward the bill.

[Gibbon]

But where did you get your work ethic from? Parental influence or something that's inherently part of who you are?

That's hard to quantify really. Both sets of parents worked so that could be construed as a positive influence, but I know people from non-working backgrounds who've done well and vice versa so it's not an absolutism. At the end of the day I think it's lazy to use background as a definite reason of later failure in life. Admittedly it makes it harder.

[Bunk]

Sometimes I wish that AI WOULD overthrow the human race. I'd quite fancy being ruled by a cold, logical, amoral machine logic instead of the usual shower of idiots we end up with. Might make a refreshing change.

WHS

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[Zero Liability]

There is a lot of truth in that, also there is a fallacy that education is to blame. Lack of work ethic and can do attitude are a lot more to blame. Neither I or my better-half hold a degree level qualification but we have a joint household income well in excess of 150K. Both of us left school at 16 with a clutch of 'O' levels. However we are targets of envy amongst some relatives as its 'alright for us as we have lots of money'. Yet they wouldn't work away from home at times, feel comfortable on short volatile contracts or in my wife's case take on huge responsibilities heading up a 800 strong workforce.

Oh but there's plenty of "pushers" of the education industry bubble. I think it's beginning to expose the ludicrous aim of 50%+ of the population having a degree, to cover up the holes left in pre-university education, e.g. employers when surveyed express concern about candidates being both innumerate and illiterate, and this includes those with degrees. You certainly don't "need" a degree to succeed, but this isn't the message getting across to young people. The educational system does not impart sound financial or entrepreneurial skills, either. In a sense, these are more crucial than knowing the ins and outs of WW2.

Apprenticeships are one of the few of the more sensible things the government is promoting in this regard.

[vetran]

Oh do push off. I'm not a leftie. But it doesn't make economic sense to try and fix the economy by sanctioning benefits claimants - the savings are tiny and even more so in proportion to the inconvenience caused. Taking away someone's benefits for a month because they're a few minutes late to the JobCentre saves pennies only. And with unemployment falling, targeting those on benefits makes even less sense!

I sort of agree the sanctions seem harsh but if justified they make a lot of sense.

I think they have realised some little hitlers in the job centre need managing and haave tightened up the rules for sanctions. - which is a good thing.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/b...othing-culture

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...s-nov-2013.pdf

From the tory loving granuiad as you can see benefits are a really large proportion of GDP.

Benefits in Britain: separating the facts from the fiction | Politics | The Guardian

[lilelvis2000]

That's hard to quantify really. Both sets of parents worked so that could be construed as a positive influence, but I know people from non-working backgrounds who've done well and vice versa so it's not an absolutism. At the end of the day I think it's lazy to use background as a definite reason of later failure in life. Admittedly it makes it harder.

I think that throughout history it can be shown that those who "just got by" in school often go on to reach great success. Why? Because they just plain try harder than a bloke with A's who believe he can fetch a brilliant job any time he likes.

People like Gary Kildall, Bill Gates, Steve jobs to name just three.

[SueEllen]

I think that throughout history it can be shown that those who "just got by" in school often go on to reach great success. Why? Because they just plain try harder than a bloke with A's who believe he can fetch a brilliant job any time he likes.

People like Gary Kildall, Bill Gates, Steve jobs to name just three.

It also helps if you have middle class parents who can help you.

The people I've met who I've admired are those whose parents had SFA and had attitudes to match. However they tend to be the one out of the 5+ in their family who made it.