Should I bill for days I was told not to attend?

[bobspud]

Hang on. I repeatedly make this point. We are the _key_ knowledge industry and should not be shuffling around like the the office temp.

Ask yourself what would a barrister do if you lined him up for a day then told him to jog on at the last minute?

Would you
a) Get an angry pelican with a large bill attached? or
b) Get an understanding grunt and an agreement to re-arrange for later on?

How would HMRC know or care if you didn't get paid for a single day of non work? Its a crap concept and there should be better arguments to this from a MOO point of view.

The main one pointer for MOO is the end of the contract when they tell you that they don't want to give you the next job or the part where you decide not to accept any more work despite it being on the table...

[BrilloPad]

If you bill and they weren't expecting it they might terminate your contract.

[Freaki Li Cuatre]

Hmmm does the pimp still get his pound of flesh in these circumstances? I guess not. Get on the blower and let the agent sort things out for you.

[flipFlop]

You get paid for the work that you do. You did no work, so you get no pay.

No. You get paid for the time that you dedicate to the client. So you get paid.

[psychocandy]

Hang on. I repeatedly make this point. We are the _key_ knowledge industry and should not be shuffling around like the the office temp.

Ask yourself what would a barrister do if you lined him up for a day then told him to jog on at the last minute?

Would you
a) Get an angry pelican with a large bill attached? or
b) Get an understanding grunt and an agreement to re-arrange for later on?

How would HMRC know or care if you didn't get paid for a single day of non work? Its a crap concept and there should be better arguments to this from a MOO point of view.

The main one pointer for MOO is the end of the contract when they tell you that they don't want to give you the next job or the part where you decide not to accept any more work despite it being on the table...

Bobspud has a point. Even though this work to get paid thing rings true like he said if you're lined up to work and the client cancels at last min what do you do? How far do you let things go? One day like this maybe but thats about it if you ask me.

OK. Put it another day. Client has you lined up to do some important work on a Friday. Thursday 5pm you tell him nah not bothered I'm playing golf tomorrow now sorry. How would that go down? Would client say ok no problem? I dont think so.

[billybiro]

Hang on. I repeatedly make this point. We are the _key_ knowledge industry and should not be shuffling around like the the office temp.

Ask yourself what would a barrister do if you lined him up for a day then told him to jog on at the last minute?

This. Exactly this.

Yep it's called business good will.

No, it isn't. Business "good will" is taking the client for a meal/drink at the end of a (mutually beneficial) contract and shaking their hand before you wave goodbye.
This crap above is called "being a fecking doormat" and people who regularly bend over while the client them in the ass are pathetically desperate. It's about time some people grew a bloody spine.

[northernladuk]

So what do the advocates of bill everything do when a site has a shut down period or black out dates such as banks etc and you are asked not to come in? Bill them anyway?

[jamesbrown]

Unless the contract says that you can expect compensation for the absence of reasonable notification of no work, I cannot see how you could expect to be compensated for that "lost opportunity". But you surely cannot expect to be paid for no work, that's absurd.

[malvolio]

Fascinating. 14 years of IR35 case law and precedent and we still have this total lack of understanding of Mutuality. The "bill-and-be-damned" crowd probably should be, but the test is an irreducible minimum of mutuality of obligation. Being paid for not working is not the minimum, regardless of why you are not working.

Seriously, if you don't understand the logic, stop arguing. My ribs won't take much more.

[billybiro]

So what do the advocates of bill everything do when a site has a shut down period or black out dates such as banks etc and you are asked not to come in? Bill them anyway?

But this wouldn't come as a surprise and out of the blue, would it? You'd either be told that you're not required on specific days or you'd ask about that during the interview. Such things are usually planned well in advance.

What we're talking about here is a "normal working day" whereby you're expected to be on-site and working for the client but being told, at incredibly short notice, that you're not required - go home - don't invoice me.

Think about the lawyers again. A lawyer knows he's not going to work on Xmas day so he doesn't bill for that - it's expected he won't work on Xmas Day. If, however, he turns up at your home/office on a normal working Tuesday morning after you've specifically instructed him to do work on your behalf, but you then tell him to piss off as he's not required for the day, you will certainly still get billed for it.

Trust me, I've worked for lawyers. There is nothing they won't bill for.