Clients pushing it too far - extra stuff etc?

[psychocandy]

I know I'm going to get the standard WGAS from some of you here but just interested in what others think.

How far do you push the flexibility thing for your client in terms of extra hours/ other stuff etc?

I know some of you will use the analogy that you a plumber wouldnt work extra for free or let you take advantage so why let your client do so.

However, I'm off the opinion that we've let ourselves be shafted a little by this professional working day idea (it wasnt like this 15 years ago when I last contracted). And with the market being so flat sometimes we really want to get that extension.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that most clients just want a contractor who acts like a permie. Doesnt moan about what they're contracted to do and just does it. For me, I dont mind doing a bit extra and being bit flexible in order to look good to secure my extension. However, I aint arse licking for the sake of it like a permie.

Unfortunately, sometimes this leads to taking the piss. Like PMs thinking its ok to phone me at the weekends to 'help out' when theres nothing I can do and theres a guy being paid to be on call anyway. (and of course no-ones sorted anything which allows me to bill this)

Annoys me because it puts me as the contractor in the position of looking like an unreasonable git when I say no can do because I've got family commitments!

[cojak]

I don't answer my work contacts at weekends.

[malvolio]

Fine, if that's what you want to do. But have a read of the recent LJL case - not having project deliverables of some kind and simply doing whatever you're asked (told?) to do means you are wide open to being IR35 caught.

As for "Professional Working Day", it means what is says. If I do any amount of work for a client in any 24 hour period, they get an invoice for a day's work at the rate inthe contract. Any other interpretation means you have an 8 hour a day hourly contract with no overtime. I don't do that.

[tractor]

...

I know I'm going to get the standard WGAS from some of you here but just interested in what others think.

How far do you push the flexibility thing for your client in terms of extra hours/ other stuff etc?

I know some of you will use the analogy that you a plumber wouldnt work extra for free or let you take advantage so why let your client do so.

However, I'm off the opinion that we've let ourselves be shafted a little by this professional working day idea (it wasnt like this 15 years ago when I last contracted). And with the market being so flat sometimes we really want to get that extension.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that most clients just want a contractor who acts like a permie. Doesnt moan about what they're contracted to do and just does it. For me, I dont mind doing a bit extra and being bit flexible in order to look good to secure my extension. However, I aint arse licking for the sake of it like a permie.

Unfortunately, sometimes this leads to taking the piss. Like PMs thinking its ok to phone me at the weekends to 'help out' when theres nothing I can do and theres a guy being paid to be on call anyway. (and of course no-ones sorted anything which allows me to bill this)

Annoys me because it puts me as the contractor in the position of looking like an unreasonable git when I say no can do because I've got family commitments!

I always find that when they realise a phone call or an appearance will cost them a day regardless of how long said intrusion lasts, they will end up calling anyone but you.

If they cry about it, simply ask them if they will pay you for doing nothing? When they say no, say well you cannot expect me to work for nothing. It couldn't be simpler. If that doesn't work don't answer the phone

[psychocandy]

I always find that when they realise a phone call or an appearance will cost them a day regardless of how long said intrusion lasts, they will end up calling anyone but you.

If they cry about it, simply ask them if they will pay you for doing nothing? When they say no, say well you cannot expect me to work for nothing. It couldn't be simpler. If that doesn't work don't answer the phone

Contract states max 22 days per month which pretty much equals working days in a month. If I invoice for 23 they wouldnt pay it anyway.

[oscarose]

Like PMs thinking its ok to phone me at the weekends to 'help out' when theres nothing I can do and theres a guy being paid to be on call anyway. (and of course no-ones sorted anything which allows me to bill this)

IMVH opinion, at the weekend it’s best to switch off your mobile. If I’ve been down the pub or drinking at home I won’t answer the phone.
Hope this helps.
orose

[psychocandy]

I don't answer my work contacts at weekends.

Perfectly right but then theres a thin line between looking like an awkward git who wont even answer one call.

[tractor]

..

IMVH opinion, at the weekend it’s best to switch off your mobile. If I’ve been down the pub or drinking at home I won’t answer the phone.
Hope this helps.
orose

Precisely Either switch the phone off or renegotiate if it has become regular or a problem.

[malvolio]

Contract states max 22 days per month which pretty much equals working days in a month. If I invoice for 23 they wouldnt pay it anyway.

So what?

If you are contracted for 22 days and they ask you to do 23, why wouldn't you invoice them for it? It's their contract they're trying to break, and it's their management that will have the argument with finance about unapproved expenditure. Also, of course, they only don't pay you once, after that you don't do the work or answer questions.

[eek]

I always find that when they realise a phone call or an appearance will cost them a day regardless of how long said intrusion lasts, they will end up calling anyone but you.

If they cry about it, simply ask them if they will pay you for doing nothing? When they say no, say well you cannot expect me to work for nothing. It couldn't be simpler. If that doesn't work don't answer the phone

+1 when I did this before I pointed out that the only reason I couldn't charge less than my daily rate was because that was the only figure mentioned within the contract. The client paid up and I wrote a document outlining fixes and issues to investigate prior to ringing me so that they shouldn't need to do it again.