Survey... in, out, shake it all about?

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Not sure who I’d be justifying it to, or why, but an obvious reason would be to keep skills current to enable profits in future.

It’s perfectly normal for companies to run at a loss, and that was the purpose of the IR35 legislation in the first place (to make small companies lose money and go out of business).

What are you guys on about?

Making me paranoid with all these weird fears you have about this and that.

You can't get expenses on an inside gig. At all.

You are employed on the same basis as an employee for tax purposes and permies can't get expenses for travelling to their regular place of work - so neither can you.

You can't use your LTD as a dodge to pay expenses free of personal tax to which you are not entitled.

The only way I know of to get these paid would be an outside IR35 gig or to be an MP - or be a permie employee of a consulting firm where you are home based and no contract is expected to (or does) last longer than 2 years.

[hugebrain]

You can't get expenses on an inside gig. At all.

You are employed on the same basis as an employee for tax purposes and permies can't get expenses for travelling to their regular place of work - so neither can you.

You can't use your LTD as a dodge to pay expenses free of personal tax to which you are not entitled.

The only way I know of to get these paid would be an outside IR35 gig or to be an MP - or be a permie employee of a consulting firm where you are home based and no contract is expected to (or does) last longer than 2 years.

But I thought permies had the same regular place of work rules as decent people? For example, I work less than two days a week in the office (and less than two years) so it’s not considered my normal workplace. As a temporary employee (shudder) wouldn’t I be able to get paid hotel expenses without it being a benefit in kind, if my employer deigned to give them to me?

What if I worked three IR35 caught jobs simultaneously? Would all of them be my regular workplace, even if they were in different cities?

[eek]

But I thought permies had the same regular place of work rules as decent people? For example, I work less than two days a week in the office (and less than two years) so it’s not considered my normal workplace. As a temporary employee (shudder) wouldn’t I be able to get paid hotel expenses without it being a benefit in kind, if my employer deigned to give them to me?

What if I worked three IR35 caught jobs simultaneously? Would all of them be my regular workplace, even if they were in different cities?

You need to look at HMRC’s travel and expenses manuals - it is way,way more complex than what you outline there and rather more biased towards journeys being commuting than you would think.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

But I thought permies had the same regular place of work rules as decent people? For example, I work less than two days a week in the office (and less than two years) so it’s not considered my normal workplace. As a temporary employee (shudder) wouldn’t I be able to get paid hotel expenses without it being a benefit in kind, if my employer deigned to give them to me?

What is or is not considered your normal workplace isn't determined by how often you have to go there. If an employer is prepared to designate your home as your place of work (most have an office address specified) in the contract then you might qualify for expenses to visit the office - but that would be rare in my experience, and even then HMRC may disagree.

What if I worked three IR35 caught jobs simultaneously? Would all of them be my regular workplace, even if they were in different cities?

Potentially yes - A permie employee who worked in a pub, a coffee bar and a cafe would be expected to pay their own travel expenses from taxable income for each of the three jobs they hold - why are you any different?
When you work inside IR35 you are in the same tax position - but with no employment rights.
If you want tax-free expenses, you really need to become an MP.

You seem to have gone a bit quiet about your original contention that you could use your limited co to pay expenses btw.

[hugebrain]

What is or is not considered your normal workplace isn't determined by how often you have to go there. If an employer is prepared to designate your home as your place of work (most have an office address specified) in the contract then you might qualify for expenses to visit the office - but that would be rare in my experience, and even then HMRC may disagree.

Potentially yes - A permie employee who worked in a pub, a coffee bar and a cafe would be expected to pay their own travel expenses from taxable income for each of the three jobs they hold - why are you any different?
When you work inside IR35 you are in the same tax position - but with no employment rights.
If you want tax-free expenses, you really need to become an MP.

You seem to have gone a bit quiet about your original contention that you could use your limited co to pay expenses btw.

When I worked last worked as a permie I worked at two office locations Reading and Newbury. When I went to Newbury they paid my travel expenses. When they sent me a bit further (New Orleans) they paid for hotels and meals.

if my main office is at home and my company sends me out to different locations from time to time I’d expect the company to pay me in the same way.

I doubt I’ll take any inside IR35 contracts, if I do I’ll check up on the rules. I’d be surprised if as well as paying more tax and having no employment rights there were special anti-contractor rules on travel. But who knows, the Conservatives are crazy, e.g. subsidising power bills so BP can whack up their prices a bit more,