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State of the Market

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    Originally posted by founder View Post
    is it a scam?
    Bet they want you to update your CV and suggest a £500 company to do so


    Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

    Comment


      Originally posted by jayn200 View Post
      Why so many years in 2nd line support and why support with a CS degree?
      I did not do a gap year in uni and gain that valuable 1 year work experience. So, when I graduated, I had no work experience related to my degree. I looked around for a year and finally threw in the hat and went into support. Most of my mates did the same. At the end of the day, working to survive is far important.

      Originally posted by uk contractor View Post
      Sorry that is not interesting at all! You live in a bubble or never made it into the bigger leagues!

      I was taking home (not earning!) £80K PA well over 20 years ago doing 2nd line trader support in the square mile back in the days when lunchtime was 2-3 hours in a pub (paid for by the end client) then another 1-2 hours in a lap dancing club (all paid by the end client). The managers did not bat an eyelid nor care as work was done & everyone was happy!

      I know ex contractors who were getting £160K PA doing 3rd line support in the square mile 25 years ago (when contractor tax & ni were almost non existent!)! others I worked with got so many shares when they joined as perms (from contractor) they were millionaires when they cashed them in due to the size of their property portfolios the IT income (only their secondary income stream!) allowed them to build!

      Now things are way different if you got £100 a day for 2nd line support WFH or not the rate would be similar as your competing with tens of thousands of contractors if you could even get the contract to begin with!

      IT Support goldrush ended about 7-8 years ago its been a race to the bottom eversince.

      Retrain into a niche AI, dev or cloud role then try to blag it (going to be difficult now as the hiring manager will insist on technical tests to prove you can backup your CV) or start a business in another sector or if you can afford to wait the pandemic lockdowns out & see if demand picks up (not likely for support but for cloud & other sidelined projects perhaps it might see some traction in Q3-Q4).
      Things have changed considerably over the years. Pay has gone downhill. When I was in my first role, we had a guy in our team who did Trader support only and he was on 100k and even slept at work in a bed! Meanwhile, rest of the guys in the team were on 20k. I have never liked traders. Yes, you get paid more to support them but how much do you want to degrade yourself as a human being?
      Thank you for the suggestion of looking into going into Cloud.

      Originally posted by uk contractor View Post
      Too late now but staying in the same place was the correct answer as eventually everyone else leaves & you become last man standing so they start to develop your career & give you your dream IT job in the organisation!

      The harsh reality for me & many others is we stayed as contractors for way too long due to £££ greed then would not accept lower rates, or perm offers for the same role so now the music has stopped & you have tens of thousands of highly skilled, highly experienced IT contractors not realistically able to get another decent IT contract due to the pandemic reducing demand & shutting most offices for the immediate future.

      That is the harsh daylight reality how you handle & accept that is down to what you have learned business wise.
      That geeza at my first place is still doing 2nd line. He's still on 20k. Thank God I moved on

      Btw, 2nd line perm roles these days pay between 30k-35k.
      Last edited by Destiny2; 25 November 2020, 19:11.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Destiny2 View Post
        I did not do a gap year in uni and gain that valuable 1 year work experience. So, when I graduated, I had no work experience related to my degree. I looked around for a year and finally threw the hat and went into support. Most of my mates did the same. At the end of the day, working to survive is far important.
        Neither myself or the people I graduated did gap years.

        We realised that we would have to take a first job anywhere in the UK and even abroad to gain experience. No-one ended up in support though a couple ended up in sales.

        Lots of people I know including my siblings did similar.
        "You’re just a bad memory who doesn’t know when to go away" JR

        Comment


          Originally posted by SueEllen View Post
          Neither myself or the people I graduated did gap years.

          We realised that we would have to take a first job anywhere in the UK and even abroad to gain experience. No-one ended up in support though a couple ended up in sales.

          Lots of people I know including my siblings did similar.
          This. Easy to say with hindsight - but the mistake was going from a CS degree to a support job, and sticking in that area. It'll be tricky moving out of that in the current market.

          Comment


            State of the market latest :

            You see an advert but you can't get hold of the agency rep as he has given his work number but he is holed up in his home. And, if you can't get hold of the agency rep, your CV is a needle in the haystack of other unqualified CV's.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Destiny2 View Post
              State of the market latest :

              You see an advert but you can't get hold of the agency rep as he has given his work number but he is holed up in his home. And, if you can't get hold of the agency rep, your CV is a needle in the haystack of other unqualified CV's.
              Here is a BIG clue! If an agent does not get back to you within say 2 hours consider your cv binned!

              Comment


                Originally posted by uk contractor View Post
                Here is a BIG clue! If an agent does not get back to you within say 2 hours consider your cv binned!
                Not necessarily. Once, I called an agent 2 days later and still got the interview

                Meanwhile, I spoke to an agent recently and he said that he received hundred CV's in half an hour and most were timewasters who had no work experience or skills whatsoever but were just trying out their luck.

                Comment


                  boomer gold mine

                  Originally posted by uk contractor View Post
                  Sorry that is not interesting at all! You live in a bubble or never made it into the bigger leagues!

                  I was taking home (not earning!) £80K PA well over 20 years ago doing 2nd line trader support in the square mile back in the days when lunchtime was 2-3 hours in a pub (paid for by the end client) then another 1-2 hours in a lap dancing club (all paid by the end client). The managers did not bat an eyelid nor care as work was done & everyone was happy!

                  I know ex contractors who were getting £160K PA doing 3rd line support in the square mile 25 years ago (when contractor tax & ni were almost non existent!)! others I worked with got so many shares when they joined as perms (from contractor) they were millionaires when they cashed them in due to the size of their property portfolios the IT income (only their secondary income stream!) allowed them to build!

                  Now things are way different if you got £100 a day for 2nd line support WFH or not the rate would be similar as your competing with tens of thousands of contractors if you could even get the contract to begin with!

                  IT Support goldrush ended about 7-8 years ago its been a race to the bottom eversince.

                  Retrain into a niche AI, dev or cloud role then try to blag it (going to be difficult now as the hiring manager will insist on technical tests to prove you can backup your CV) or start a business in another sector or if you can afford to wait the pandemic lockdowns out & see if demand picks up (not likely for support but for cloud & other sidelined projects perhaps it might see some traction in Q3-Q4).
                  im not sure comparing the "golden" years is a good example. Its a bit like me saying my parents (divorced) take 10 holidays a year, nevr went to uni and live the life of riley. your above statement is basically why boomers ruined it for everyone. but kudos for fleecing the rates for low skilled work

                  Comment


                    So I’m tentatively dipping my toe back into the water as my contract finishes on 18th December.

                    I always work my network rather than go via recruiters if I can and this week I was reminded why.

                    A colleague who I worked with recently connected me with two recruiters on LinkedIn chat, about a contract he passed on as he’s just signed paperwork for another deal.

                    They reached out to me, asked for my number and best time to chat.

                    I responded to both and then.....nothing.

                    Ghosted.

                    Back to the network.



                    Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by bownyboy View Post
                      So I’m tentatively dipping my toe back into the water as my contract finishes on 18th December.

                      I always work my network rather than go via recruiters if I can and this week I was reminded why.

                      A colleague who I worked with recently connected me with two recruiters on LinkedIn chat, about a contract he passed on as he’s just signed paperwork for another deal.

                      They reached out to me, asked for my number and best time to chat.

                      I responded to both and then.....nothing.

                      Ghosted.

                      Back to the network.



                      Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum
                      Its a numbers game. Expecting something to materialize from 2 recruiters/contract ads just isn't realistic. Probably 50 is a more realistic number.

                      Comment

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