Where does the agencies control end?

[unixman]

TL;DR: If the client is happy for me to work from home, can my pimp stop me from doing so? I will check my contract, but I don't see why the pimp should care where I work from as long as client is happy. :\

WHOA! I must disagree with almost everyone on this thread.

It sounds like very poor behaviour from the agency. Attempting to bully a sick person to work is not reasonable. It is bad for the whole company and will lead to cross-infection and more absence.

However, your contract is with the agency, and you are therefore ultimately answerable to them. Make no mistake in this. So, yes, you must listen to the agent and keep them happy if you want to continue in your role. The agency has the right to serve notice in your contract, should they be unhappy or the need arise. Even the end client does not have this power (not directly). So the agent is your real customer and the nearest thing you have to a boss.

That said, it sounds like there is a big gap between the agent's expectations and the end client's, regarding your whereabouts. They should be having regular meetings with each other but perhaps they don't. Or maybe the client is falling out with the agent, or looking for a new agent. Who knows.

I would (a) not have volunteered to WFH during to sickness. It makes it look like you aren't really sick. (b) Stay at home until you are completely well, provide a doctor's note if needed. (c) Not mix this up with WFH wishes, do not talk about WFH. (d) After you are completely well and back at work, then discuss WFH politely with both the agent and client.

And stop calling them pimps for Pete's sake. i wonder what agents call us on their forums?

[WTFH]

And stop calling them pimps for Pete's sake. i wonder what agents call us on their forums?

"B..stards"
"Money trees"
"Whores"
"Pros" (i.e. prostitutes)

[MrMarkyMark]

However, your contract is with the agency, and you are therefore ultimately answerable to them. Make no mistake in this. So, yes, you must listen to the agent and keep them happy if you want to continue in your role. The agency has the right to serve notice in your contract, should they be unhappy or the need arise. Even the end client does not have this power (not directly). So the agent is your real customer and the nearest thing you have to a boss.

From a purely legal and contractual perspective, yes, you are correct.

However, this was in a slightly different context, as the client was happy with the arrangment. If the client is happy then the agent should be happy, that was my point.

You can consider your agent your "boss" if you want, however, I won't be.
In my case my relationship with my agent is very much a B2B and infact I plan on working with him on potential opportunities in the future. This will be outside the current type of agency contractor business relationship.

I will repeat again, it is better to get everything out in the open / agreed at the outset, that goes for all types of Business relationship, not just IT contracting.

[vwdan]

The agency has the right to serve notice in your contract, should they be unhappy or the need arise. Even the end client does not have this power (not directly). So the agent is your real customer and the nearest thing you have to a boss.

Written on paper, perhaps - but in the real world, hardly. Any agent that would pull a contractor from a happy client isn't going to remain an agent very long which brings us back to my original point - keep the client happy and forget about the agent. Seriously - think about what you wrote for a minute. A contractor is working towards a big go-live - they've done loads of excellent work and everyone is very happy. Then, one morning the client gets a call from the agent to say "Yeah, I've had to sack Unixman because I didn't think he was pulling his weight." It's just so unlikely that it's not even worth considering as a possibility. Some of the PM's I've worked with would probably, quite literally, drive to the agents office and issue genuine threats of physical harm if it was at a critical moment.

And nearest thing to a boss - in what world? Most of the agents who've placed me couldn't even pronounce half the technology I work with, let alone have the slightest clue about what I'm doing, how I'm doing it and why I'm doing it. And they're sure as tulip not going to tell me how to spend my day when I have an agreement with the customer.

And in fairness, most agents do the same thing as well - get a contractor on site, make sure the client is happy and then leave them to it until renewal time. Agents are there to deal with the paperwork and recruitment process - they're not there to manage the day to day relationship when things are going fine.

Even when I've worked with proper consultancies (as opposed to agencies) they're much the same. A little more interested in really ensuring the customer is happy, but otherwise very hands off.

[unixman]

Most of the agents who've placed me couldn't even pronounce half the technology I work with, let alone have the slightest clue about what I'm...

Lol. Be as gung-ho as you like. It doesn't alter the fact that the agent is the one writing your cheques, and can bin you at a moments notice according to the contract that you both have signed. This is a fact which can become obscured in the day-to-day rush and I don't want the OP to me made suddenly aware of it in some jarring, unpleasant way.

It is also true that in case the agent seems to be in the wrong and exercising very poor judgement. A careful phone call or two from the OP will likely soothe matters. Agent and client need to align themselves.

[vwdan]

Lol. Be as gung-ho as you like. It doesn't alter the fact that the agent is the one writing your cheques, and can bin you at a moments notice according to the contract that you both have signed. This is a fact which can become obscured in the day-to-day rush and I don't want the OP to me made suddenly aware of it in some jarring, unpleasant way.

It is also true that in case the agent seems to be in the wrong and exercising very poor judgement. A careful phone call or two from the OP will likely soothe matters. Agent and client need to align themselves.

I do see what point you're making but while they may be writing the cheque, it's still the client who is paying for my services and theirs. Sure they can bin me, but they won't!

But yes, I'm sure this particular issue can be squared away quickly.

[MrMarkyMark]

A good agent values his contract and gets them repeat work.
I know this is rare in the IT contracting industry, but I guess I'm lucky in that respect.

He cerainly shouldn't be interfering with day to day work / issues when, ultimately, the client is happy.

[WTFH]

Written on paper, perhaps - but in the real world, hardly. Any agent that would pull a contractor from a happy client isn't going to remain an agent very long which brings us back to my original point - keep the client happy and forget about the agent. Seriously - think about what you wrote for a minute. A contractor is working towards a big go-live - they've done loads of excellent work and everyone is very happy. Then, one morning the client gets a call from the agent to say "Yeah, I've had to sack Unixman because I didn't think he was pulling his weight." It's just so unlikely that it's not even worth considering as a possibility. Some of the PM's I've worked with would probably, quite literally, drive to the agents office and issue genuine threats of physical harm if it was at a critical moment.

And nearest thing to a boss - in what world? Most of the agents who've placed me couldn't even pronounce half the technology I work with, let alone have the slightest clue about what I'm doing, how I'm doing it and why I'm doing it. And they're sure as tulip not going to tell me how to spend my day when I have an agreement with the customer.

And in fairness, most agents do the same thing as well - get a contractor on site, make sure the client is happy and then leave them to it until renewal time. Agents are there to deal with the paperwork and recruitment process - they're not there to manage the day to day relationship when things are going fine.

Except, you are only thinking of that one contract. Decide to p off the agent and they'll not be in a rush to use you in the future. But more importantly, while you see the agent as someone to get you into a client, they see you as a commodity to sell.


Agents are salesmen.
They have sales targets.
If they expect to invoice £10k this month and then you take 2 weeks off so they only invoice £5k for you, then they either need to find more sales, or to put it in their diary that they won't hit their target that month. Remember, they get paid commission and bonuses based on hitting targets.
Alternatively, you let them know 3 months in advance (or 3 weeks), and then the salesman can plan for that.


If I'm taking a day off here or there I'd rarely say, but if I've booked a week or fortnight off on holiday, I would let them know out of courtesy. I'm not asking their permission, I'm telling them what I am doing, and I try to do it far enough in advance.

[NotAllThere]

...
However, your contract is with the agency, and you are therefore ultimately answerable to them. Make no mistake in this. So, yes, you must listen to the agent and keep them happy if you want to continue in your role. The agency has the right to serve notice in your contract, should they be unhappy or the need arise. Even the end client does not have this power (not directly). So the agent is your real customer and the nearest thing you have to a boss...

Complete

Utter

Twaddle.


Did you just receive a blow to the head? Any agent who canned a contractor the client was happy with would end up rapidly without a client.

[unixman]

Complete

Utter

Twaddle.


Did you just receive a blow to the head? Any agent who canned a contractor the client was happy with would end up rapidly without a client.

Nobody said anything different. What part of my post do you disagree with? Did you even read it ? FFS.