Client wants to hire me as a permie

[Sid]

Client was not sure during interview how they want to fill the role(contractor/permie). Now that i have interviewed, they want me to join as a permie- offer being good. Having left the permie world I would never go back to it. How should I make a pitch for them to give me a contract position?

[northernladuk]

If it's permie work it will be inside IR35. Just walk away.

[TykeMerc]

If it's permie work it will be inside IR35. Just walk away.

Overly simplistic and quite inaccurate, why keep on trolling the threads in the professional forums with these formulaic responses?

To Sid if the client has decided they want a permie odds are you can't talk them into taking you on contract, it's not worth the effort trying.

[northernladuk]

Overly simplistic and quite inaccurate, why keep on trolling the threads in the professional forums with these formulaic responses?

To Sid if the client has decided they want a permie odds are you can't talk them into taking you on contract, it's not worth the effort trying.

Lol. Trolling my arse. How can you not be a disguised permie as a contractor doing a permie role which is what they want. They won't have defined schedule of work, they wont accept a sub, they will want to give you extra work whenever and so on. Just because he wants to negotiate using his LTD they will treat him a permie so Just walk away.

You'll be accusing me of being a sockie next.

[TykeMerc]

Lol. Trolling my arse. How can you not be a disguised permie as a contractor doing a permie role which is what they want. They won't have defined schedule of work, they wont accept a sub, they will want to give you extra work whenever and so on. Just because he wants to negotiate using his LTD they will treat him a permie so Just walk away.

You'll be accusing me of being a sockie next.

How can you expect to be taken seriously typing lol?

Your absurd over simplification clearly puts 99.99% of contract work past and present as IR35 caught. EVERY single contract role could be filled by a permie, it may not be terribly practical for some, but they almost all could be.

[northernladuk]

How can you expect to be taken seriously typing lol?

Your absurd over simplification clearly puts 99.99% of contract work past and present as IR35 caught. EVERY single contract role could be filled by a permie, it may not be terribly practical for some, but they almost all could be.

Wow... Some has over done the Stella this weekend. You know better than this so I don't know why you are arguing. All the work I take is a single piece of work with a finite end. A permie cannot fill that because there is no work after it so what you are saying is just not true. Yes there are a large number of contractors on clients fulfill enduring roles, more the fool them, and yes there are a number of clients that are contractor heavy and really have a larger core of permies but that is the resourcing model at the moment and it's gonna get worse. We could argue about this for years as we have with IR35 but that's one thing... Trying to come in as a contractor when the client wants a permie is something else. Anyway.. Someone is a bit aggressive so I'm done with this. He's had the same advice off both of us in the end so jobs done.

[TykeMerc]

Wow... Some has over done the Stella this weekend. You know better than this so I don't know why you are arguing. All the work I take is a single piece of work with a finite end. A permie cannot fill that because there is no work after it so what you are saying is just not true. Yes there are a large number of contractors on clients fulfill enduring roles, more the fool them, and yes there are a number of clients that are contractor heavy and really have a larger core of permies but that is the resourcing model at the moment and it's gonna get worse. We could argue about this for years as we have with IR35 but that's one thing... Trying to come in as a contractor when the client wants a permie is something else. Anyway.. Someone is a bit aggressive so I'm done with this. He's had the same advice off both of us in the end so jobs done.

I don't drink Stella.

I don't know what role you think you perform, but acting like it's one that's never filled by a permie is ludicrous. The large outsourcers like HP, Cap, IBM, Atos, Serco etc have permies in all sorts of specialist roles who are deployed to projects and accounts as required, there are also smaller specialist consultancies selling services into clients much the same way we work as contractors.

When you throw out the type of absurd oversimplified response like your first post you just appear dismissive and bone headed.

[tomtomagain]

To the OP

If you genuinely want to stay a contractor and don't mind losing the role I'd say to them :

"I am not ready to be permie. Please offer me a six month contract and we can review at the end".

If they want you, you might get it. If they don't, you wont. But there's not much use messing around - just be upfront.

[LondonManc]

To the OP

If you genuinely want to stay a contractor and don't mind losing the role I'd say to them :

"I am not ready to be permie. Please offer me a six month contract and we can review at the end".

If they want you, you might get it. If they don't, you wont. But there's not much use messing around - just be upfront.

Wrong advice IMHO. Just smacks of "please can I do six months of permie work as a contractor".

Better asking for a project or set of deliverables to work on as a contractor so that both candidate and client can see if the role is better suited to a perm.

[NotAllThere]

Lol. Trolling my arse. How can you not be a disguised permie as a contractor doing a permie role which is what they want. They won't have defined schedule of work, they wont accept a sub, they will want to give you extra work whenever and so on.

I'm with TM on this one. It is entirely possible to have a set of work that needs doing, with a defined schedule, set of tasks, period of time etc. If they fill it with a contractor, they treat the worker as a contractor. If they fill it with a permie, they treat the worker as a permie.

As has often been discussed, it is the working practices that make the difference.

Yes, they may be identical, but there's absolutely no necessity whatsoever that they are. Most hiring managers I've worked with are quite aware of the differences in hiring a permie and a contractor in terms of the way they will work, and how they'll be utilised.

For the OP, just tell them that you're not interested in permie, but you'll be happy to take the role as a contractor. If you start to waver, say this mantra three times "appraisals, target setting".