IR35 logging daily events that prove you are outside

[pc1980]

I am new to contracting and I have read in numerous places that
you should keep a log of things which could be used to aid your case in a ir35 investigation.
Basically you should journal things that highlight that you are not an employee of the company.
This journal from my understanding would be things such as;
Not being invited to companywide quarterly financial update
Not being invited to IT weekly briefings
Not enjoying company benefits; for example deals they have with local companies
Emails which highlight you are not an employee

Firstly do any of you keep such a log of these events?
Secondly would such evidence help in an IR35 investigation?
Thirdly is this evidence out of date now we have the whole business test and having to prove you are outside IR35?

Thanks in advance

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

A bit more reading may be in order - HMR&C have moved the goalposts so far with IR35 that they are no longer on the pitch. Keeping a journal such as this may give a little weight to your case in the event of an investigation but would certainly have no impact if the main determinants put you inside.

[kingcook]

I am new to contracting and I have read in numerous places that
you should keep a log of things which could be used to aid your case in a ir35 investigation.
Basically you should journal things that highlight that you are not an employee of the company.
This journal from my understanding would be things such as;
Not being invited to companywide quarterly financial update
Not being invited to IT weekly briefings
Not enjoying company benefits; for example deals they have with local companies
Emails which highlight you are not an employee

Firstly do any of you keep such a log of these events?
Secondly would such evidence help in an IR35 investigation?
Thirdly is this evidence out of date now we have the whole business test and having to prove you are outside IR35?

I have an IR35 notes file/folder. I tend to keep note of the important things, e.g. if i was asked to work on something else and said no (with copies of email) - not that it has happened that often.

Any info you add here is better than nothing. An IR35 investigation could happen YEARS after you've finished a contract, in the meantime you've forgotton most things.

Notes are good IMHO.

[pc1980]

Any info you add here is better than nothing. An IR35 investigation could happen YEARS after you've finished a contract, in the meantime you've forgotton most things.

Notes are good IMHO.

That was my opinion.
I can't remember what I did last week let alone two years ago.

Surely if you had an inventory of evidence to aid your case it is better than saying, it was a long time ago I can't remember my working practices etc.??

[northernladuk]

If you can be bothered I don't think it does any harm to do a bit of diligence. I do keep a few particular correspondence from my client that shows clearly that I work differently to permies. I photocopy my security card at every gig when it is a different colour, keep a mail that shows my business name in email name and so on.

One word of caution about keeping a huge stash of stuff. If you don't fully understand IR35 and what/why you do it and your evidence could be used against you then you could be shooting yourself in the foot. A real business doesn't need to do this so doing too much could look you just pretending and trying too hard. You only need to submit one mail that mentions holiday or shows the client approved it thinking you were doing the right thing and you have just hung yourself.

Keep some key elements from areas that are strong flags or support your contract and forget the rest. Daily logs sound like a bad idea though.

[ecc83]

Keeping notes is good (particularly in the event of having to recall details 6 years down the line) but most of the things the OP mentions are weak indicators of employment/self employment. An email declining an invite to the Christmas party probably isn't worth keeping... an email where you inform the client what days you'll be working offsite at your own office probably are. Etc.

[Jessica@WhiteFieldTax]

If you can be bothered I don't think it does any harm to do a bit of diligence. I do keep a few particular correspondence from my client that shows clearly that I work differently to permies. I photocopy my security card at every gig when it is a different colour, keep a mail that shows my business name in email name and so on.

One word of caution about keeping a huge stash of stuff. If you don't fully understand IR35 and what/why you do it and your evidence could be used against you then you could be shooting yourself in the foot. A real business doesn't need to do this so doing too much could look you just pretending and trying too hard. You only need to submit one mail that mentions holiday or shows the client approved it thinking you were doing the right thing and you have just hung yourself.

Keep some key elements from areas that are strong flags or support your contract and forget the rest. Daily logs sound like a bad idea though.

^^ echo that. Its the sort of thing I would advise a client to do.

[platforminc]

Hi Guys

I take the advice of photocopying the ID pass, as my current gig has seperate colours for permies and suppliers (contractors).

In certain meetings, we have been told we contractors are not eligible for training, I do feel its a good pointer but I'm not going to start recording my managers conversation.

Also we were also told once that xmas meals isnt open to contractors, they can come but they will have to pay thier own costs, is this email worth keeping ?

Thanks.

[malvolio]

Also we were also told once that xmas meals isnt open to contractors, they can come but they will have to pay thier own costs, is this email worth keeping ?

Actually yes, if it's in writing. It shows you are not seen as part and parcel of the client's workforce, which is a good thing.

[Wanderer]

Basically you should journal things that highlight that you are not an employee of the company.

It's a good idea. If you get investigated and the client drops you in the tulip over things like direction and control, you can refute it by producing actual examples from the time you worked there. In court, notes made at the time or original emails will carry much more weight than people's hazy memories of how things used to be.

As for it being used against you - it would of course be foolish to give it all directly to HMRC. You would pass this on to your defence team who would sift through it and present the useful bits, quietly discarding the rest.