No To Retro Tax – Campaign Against Section 58 Finance Act 2008

[nickersan]

Yes, just a matter of time. The tax planning schemes are the low hanging fruit, once that's gone I wouldn't be surprised to see a massive clampdown on limited companies and some retrospective application of the IR35 rules.

[eek]

Yes, just a matter of time. The tax planning schemes are the low hanging fruit, once that's gone I wouldn't be surprised to see a massive clampdown on limited companies and some retrospective application of the IR35 rules.

I think that is more your personal desire rather than any plausible future.

The great shame is that it is attitudes like yours that has resulted in many others in this forum believing you deserve everything your panic ( over the non issue that is ir35) / greed has caused

[Taffia]

HMRC powers to raid accounts criticised as 'draconian'

BBC News - HMRC powers to raid accounts criticised as 'draconian'

[OnYourBikeGB]

I think that is more your personal desire rather than any plausible future.

The great shame is that it is attitudes like yours that has resulted in many others in this forum believing you deserve everything your panic ( over the non issue that is ir35) / greed has caused

I wouldn't be so sure. The recently introduced question on SA returns about being a PSC has more than a shade of DOTAS about it now. I don't think anyone can take anything for granted. Anybody who thinks that IR35 is a non-issue is making a big mistake, and worse, if you haven't taken measures to protect yourself you could well end up creating the case history that will condemn many others. Remember, they only need to win one case now. I don't think it's us that's creating a climate of apprehension. Just on another point on your attitude, operating inside IR35 while declaring yourself outside is closer to evasion than avoidance. You think that's a 'non-issue' to HMRC? You think they don't see that as greed? Dream on.

[VictorValiant]

Finance Committee

The next step, as far as I can see, is to have NTRT/Whitehouse focus on the members of the Finance Committee who will be debating the Finance Bill presumably after the Easter Recess . The debates are spread over several sessions so the timing for the debates on the clause(s) in the Bill that are relevant to our situation is probably not known - sometime between late April and end of May - before the bill goes for Royal Assent. There is also the European Elections to take into account which may well affect the timing of things. We know from past experience that certain members of the Committee support our views - I am thinking of Cathy Jamieson and Chris Leslie here amongst others - but what we need is to engender support from the Conservative/LibDem members once the make-up of the Committee is announced (early April?). My own MP - whom I have seen on several occasions - is very much still supportive and - in his view - the use of retrospection on this scale is in itself "morally repugnant" to coin a well-used phrase by you-know-who. Good words but we need more action than words and some pressure to be brought to bear.

[jbryce]

I think that is more your personal desire rather than any plausible future.

The great shame is that it is attitudes like yours that has resulted in many others in this forum believing you deserve everything your panic ( over the non issue that is ir35) / greed has caused

IR35 is not a non issue. I go to great lengths to ensure that I am IR35 compliant - at present I have two real customers. We have three active IR35 investigations in one of the places I work at the moment.

In addition, one of the large agencies we deal with is actively suggesting that new contracts are placed through an Umbrella company. They have seen an increase in IR35 investigations of late - it may just be the local office here, but may indicate that HMRC is feeling a tad more bullish as regards this non-issue.

[screwthis]

I think that is more your personal desire rather than any plausible future.

The great shame is that it is attitudes like yours that has resulted in many others in this forum believing you deserve everything your panic ( over the non issue that is ir35) / greed has caused

It's more than plausable. It's highly probable.
I think it's very evident that Hector wants everyone to go through PAYE. That was the reason for IR35 in the first place.
Do you think that one man working through a ltd company for one client should be outside IR35?
It is blantently clear that merely including a clause in the contract for right of substitution does not actually mean the right is there in practice.
Hector knows this and will seek to move against it.

Anyway, shouldn't you be on full PAYE like perms if you're as ungreedy as you say?


Your accusational assumption is unpleasant.
I'm sure the vast majority of us don't desire to see anyone else go through misfortune.
It's you with the dubious attitude taking glee in the fact that you're ok (for now) and we are being targeted.

[SantaClaus]

I wouldn't be so sure. The recently introduced question on SA returns about being a PSC has more than a shade of DOTAS about it now. I don't think anyone can take anything for granted. Anybody who thinks that IR35 is a non-issue is making a big mistake, and worse, if you haven't taken measures to protect yourself you could well end up creating the case history that will condemn many others. Remember, they only need to win one case now. I don't think it's us that's creating a climate of apprehension. Just on another point on your attitude, operating inside IR35 while declaring yourself outside is closer to evasion than avoidance. You think that's a 'non-issue' to HMRC? You think they don't see that as greed? Dream on.

Agreed. Nearly every IT contractor I have worked with has deemed themselves "outside of IR35", yet they came to the same desk for years on end, worked for the same boss, took instructions from the same project manager. They had substitution clauses, but in practice wouldn't be allowed to invoke them. Most of the time, their contracts didn't reflect reality. That to me is also classed as tax avoidance. Anyone who doesn't think so has sadly got their heads in the sand.

HMRC are getting bolder and bolder each day as they realise their powers are increasing unchecked and without much opposition.

It is only a matter of time until they come after Ltd companies... retrospectively and using the "pay upfront" legislation, with no recourse to appeal.

To those who doesn't believe me, come back here in a few years time and we'll have the same conversation. I predict by then the contracting industry will have been completely destroyed by our blundering governments.

[jbryce]

Not answering the lot as this is a thread I'm not welcome in but what else would you expect a salesman to say. He doesn't know if you are marked or not he just doesn't want you to leave.

Personally I would set up a limited company get a decent accountant and let them deal with the issues there....

Couldn't agree more. If you are in a scheme. Get out.
Start saving, be prepared fight and then, if necessary, to negotiate for time to pay.

You, like a lot us, were naive. Plan for the worst, pray for the best.

In the meantime, open up a Limited Company get a good accountant.

[smalldog]

IMHO it is only a matter of time before they come after one man ltd's. Doesn't matter how long you say it ain't gonna happen, they are just picking off the easy targets first.

Anyone using a ltd as a one person company is avoiding tax, full stop, or you would be using an umbrella. There is no other justification.