EU client, agency move from EU to UK

[dsc]

This might be a non issue...or fairly substantial, I haven't got all the info, so doing all sorts of worst-case-scenario overthinking.

I'm currently via a non UK / EU agency, doing work for an EU client, I invoice the agency, they invoice another "local" agency that the client deals with normally for EU contractors (and for time keeping), they invoice the client, the client pays the "local" agency, the "local" agency pays my agency and then my agency pays me. I got extended at the start of the year but not invoiced the last month as the "local" agency system didn't show the correct details for my extension. I've asked around and after a fair bit of waiting it turns out someone at the client co decided this agency setup is overcomplicated and decided to:

- ditch my agency without telling them - use a UK agency for all UK based contractors
- not inform me about anything (which is absolutely brilliant btw)

I can clearly see my agency being not happy about this as they got bypassed and thus loosing money, so that's one issue. Second issue is that I'm worried the UK agency will just deem everyone they have for this client as inside and effectively make all UK based contractors their "workers" to avoid any issues in the future.

I'm planning to leave the UK in the next 3-6months and use ER to disolve the company, how risky would it be to take whatever contract the UK agency offers just to avoid the hassle of being out of contract or jumping inside to outside?

[northernladuk]

This might be a non issue...or fairly substantial, I haven't got all the info, so doing all sorts of worst-case-scenario overthinking.

I'm currently via a non UK / EU agency, doing work for an EU client, I invoice the agency, they invoice another "local" agency that the client deals with normally for EU contractors (and for time keeping), they invoice the client, the client pays the "local" agency, the "local" agency pays my agency and then my agency pays me. I got extended at the start of the year but not invoiced the last month as the "local" agency system didn't show the correct details for my extension. I've asked around and after a fair bit of waiting it turns out someone at the client co decided this agency setup is overcomplicated and decided to:

- ditch my agency without telling them - use a UK agency for all UK based contractors
- not inform me about anything (which is absolutely brilliant btw)

Why would the client tell you? Your contract is with your agency, it's them that should tell you, or even the local agency. The client is the last person and has no legal relationship with you. You say they didn't know which smells suss. The renewal request should have gone up the chain and come back signed. How come your agency wasn't chasing the local agency and spot the renewal like you did? Saying no one told them doesn't sound right to me.

I can clearly see my agency being not happy about this as they got bypassed and thus loosing money, so that's one issue.
[/quote]Not your issues, they are done, not your problem. You no longer have a contract with them and that is all you need to know.[quote]

Second issue is that I'm worried the UK agency will just deem everyone they have for this client as inside and effectively make all UK based contractors their "workers" to avoid any issues in the future.
[quote]Do you not have a contract with them yet? What about the month you've worked? You did that with no contract in your hand? What about the time you will be working until this is resolved (which you shouldn't).
You'll only find what they are going to do when they issue you with a contract and if they haven't you shouldn't be working unless you are prepared to lose it all.

I'm planning to leave the UK in the next 3-6months and use ER to disolve the company, how risky would it be to take whatever contract the UK agency offers just to avoid the hassle of being out of contract or jumping inside to outside?

Hard to say until you know what the UK agent is doing and at that point it should be crystal clear. Get your contract sorted with the Uk agency and then you'll know exactly where you stand.
My guess though, would be very little risk as you were outside the scope of the legislation first and come in just because the agency didn't want a PSL, not because the client or anything has changed. Can't understand why the agent would do that to you.

Either way. Only two things for you to do. Sort your contract and get your CV on jobserve.

[dsc]

Yeah there's clearly some cock up somewhere re informing the right people as "my" agency found out via me effectively (and this is again only because I'm fairly friendly with some people at the client co). I signed a renewal with them, so there's a contract in place, it's just that the last month couldn't be clocked via the "local" agency's website (for time keeping). At that point I started enquiring and found out the "local" agency is getting dropped as the supplier (whatever it is that they were supplying). What is odd (not that it matters) is that another colleague contractor who's a local is still using that "local" agency's website and it seems like the change only covers UK based people (or so I've been told).

Atm I haven't got a contract with the UK agency (I was told its coming, but there's a huge reorg happening so it's chaos, loads of people are leaving and don't give a tulip), but I'm trying to understand how the hell my contract with the original agency was voided. This is not to change things but understand how this is even allowed, but I reckon "my" agency had an agreement with the "local" one and as the "local" one is no longer a supplier, everything downstream gets auto cancelled (how the hell this was missed by "my" agency is a mystery).

Anyways, the more I think of it, the more it seems "my" agency dropped the ball or the client dropped the ball as my extension was signed with "my" agency and they were 100% aware I got an extension as they talked to the client co (they told me I was extended). I'm aware the client was not super happy about the two-agency-combo commission, but I doubt they'd be silly enough to try and bypass an agency simply by keeping them in the dark.

Already on job boards looking for perm jobs, but we all know how well that's going for everyone

Anyways, thanks for chiming in

[northernladuk]

Yeah there's clearly some cock up somewhere re informing the right people as "my" agency found out via me effectively (and this is again only because I'm fairly friendly with some people at the client co).

SO your agency has made a hash of it. They are the ones supposed to be on top of this as it's their responsibility and their income.

I signed a renewal with them, so there's a contract in place, it's just that the last month couldn't be clocked via the "local" agency's website (for time keeping).

Signed with who? Direct to the client? The 'local agent'? Why did you do that? That's not who you are contracted to. Doing that is going to cause nothing but problems.

At that point I started enquiring and found out the "local" agency is getting dropped as the supplier (whatever it is that they were supplying). What is odd (not that it matters) is that another colleague contractor who's a local is still using that "local" agency's website and it seems like the change only covers UK based people (or so I've been told).

You said it was 'your' agency, not the 'local' agency that got dropped. You are making as much a hash of this as everyone else is.
Makes some sense to go to a UK one with the complexity of tax and cross country taxes. Your contract will be legally binding in X country but maybe not Y country even.
[quote]
Atm I haven't got a contract with the UK agency (I was told its coming, but there's a huge reorg happening so it's chaos, loads of people are leaving and don't give a tulip), but I'm trying to understand how the hell my contract with the original agency was voided.

It wasn't voided. It ended. I assume this as you mentioned renewal but you seem to be a bit liberal or confused with the facts so far so who knows.

This is not to change things but understand how this is even allowed, but I reckon "my" agency had an agreement with the "local" one and as the "local" one is no longer a supplier, everything downstream gets auto cancelled (how the hell this was missed by "my" agency is a mystery).

It was allowed because your contract ended. No relationships with anyone anymore. Yeah poor of the client or the chain to not get everyone together and discuss but that's what happens when you have a chain of 4 entities and add the EU element in. Always going to be a mess at the best of times.

Anyways, the more I think of it, the more it seems "my" agency dropped the ball or the client dropped the ball as my extension was signed with "my" agency and they were 100% aware I got an extension as they talked to the client co (they told me I was extended).

Oh, so you do have a contract signed with your agency? Jeez... Agents lie. It wouldn't be a surprise if they've just produced it and got you to sign it without even speaking to the client. They might have 'assumed' it was coming. Also... why is 'your' agency speaking to the client? They should only be speaking to the local agent i.e the next one up the chain,[qupte I'm aware the client was not super happy about the two-agency-combo commission, but I doubt they'd be silly enough to try and bypass an agency simply by keeping them in the dark.

And I can totally see why. What an utter tulip show and hats off the client for getting rid by the look of things. They aren't bypassing them, they've changed the arrangements for reasons you won't understand. This cock up is reason enough alone but the fact they've only done it for UK contractors tells us it's something to do with location and most likely either taxation or legal reasons. I'd take a guess throught the whole thing it's been a mess with your agency, dealing with local agency dealing with client. You don't know how much crap the client has possibily had to endure.
Doesn't seem unreasonable with brexit/EU issues to go with a UK agent for UK people.

Jump on the UK agency. No agent has ever given up free commission because of re-orgs. I think someone is giving you the run around. Re-orgs are not a reason to not make easy money. Tell them no contract, no work and point out the client is going to be very pissed at them if you don't do any work. The threat of them losing commission and possibly their new client will crystalise them.

[northernladuk]

Signed with who? Direct to the client? The 'local agent'? Why did you do that? That's not who you are contracted to. Doing that is going to cause nothing but problems.

Ahhh When you say 'them' you mean your agency? Sounds like the contract doesn't exist up the chain so it's pretty worthless I am afraid. As I said sounds very much like it's been done on assumptions and whispers, not via the proper chain.

[dsc]

Ahhh When you say 'them' you mean your agency? Sounds like the contract doesn't exist up the chain so it's pretty worthless I am afraid. As I said sounds very much like it's been done on assumptions and whispers, not via the proper chain.

Yeah, 'them' as in "my" agency, assumption was they knew what they were doing, but perhaps they weren't...Spoke with the hiring manager at client co who's also surprised the whole chain is going, not just the "local" agency, but I guess at this point it's down to the agencies to sort it out between themselves. I'm off the next week days anyways, so hopefully I have something to sign on Monday.

[WTFH]

Yeah, 'them' as in "my" agency, assumption was they knew what they were doing, but perhaps they weren't...Spoke with the hiring manager at client co who's also surprised the whole chain is going, not just the "local" agency, but I guess at this point it's down to the agencies to sort it out between themselves. I'm off the next week days anyways, so hopefully I have something to sign on Monday.

Can I just clarify this, you've been working for several weeks with no valid contract and have only found it out when you submitted an invoice?

This really sounds like there are several layers to this story that are being kept hidden.

[dsc]

Can I just clarify this, you've been working for several weeks with no valid contract and have only found it out when you submitted an invoice?

This really sounds like there are several layers to this story that are being kept hidden.

Had a valid contract signed at the start of the year, then around March couldn't put in hours to get the timesheet approved and the whole case unraveled itself. No idea when the contract stopped being valid, but if you take a step back to assess the situation I think "clusterf*ck" is a suitable word to describe it.

It seems to be all about the switch of the time keeping system supplier, but with it changing, the whole chain seems to have been changed which to me is a bit of a cock up.

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Just to update this thread, finally got moved to the new UK based agency, new contract issued via them and my working practices were even checked using the bloody CEST tool and that came out outside imagine my shock that using CEST you can even get such a result.

Anyways, I can finally get paid, so it's time to celebrate.