Overseas Expenses

[malvolio]

I think the key point the OP is missing is that the scale rate is a limit, not a fixed charge. So if you spend less but still claim the full scale allowance, then it's fraud, pure and simple...

Umbrellas used to use scale rates for a long time to boost their client's earnings until HMRC stamped on them very hard for doing so. It's also why expenses got binned for IR35-caught workers.

The only exception I know of where you claim the scale rate regardless is trivial costs, such as newspapers, the odd coffee or calls home from a hotel or similar.

[northernladuk]

If the accommodation cost if higher than HMRC's room rate, then it's obviously better to stick to claiming back the actual accommodation cost that was paid, hence ignoring HMRC's rate.

I think we were all waiting for this sentence. There was going to be a wangle or a gain somewhere in all this, which would be why you are so insistent. The scale rates are there to simplify things, not rip HMRC off.

I did a few stints out in the Middle East for a client and I'm not sure why but the scale rate for Egypt were particularly askew from the cost I was claiming. My accountant advised, quite sensibly, just to claim what I spent and not to look at the rates for financial gain. It just wasn't worth the hassle and potential risk.
Like Eeks says, it takes a couple of minutes to put all the receipts in to FreeAgent and job was done. No dicking about, no making money from HMRC and arguable taking the piss.

If the crux of your question is can I pick the method that makes me the most money then just go for it, fill your boots and sleep with one eye open. You won't get a straight answer from us on that one. If you have to ask which method of doing my expenses makes me the most money then you know you are doing something wrong.

Not sure what else there is to add to this one....

And yet again... WHY HAVE YOU NOT ASKED YOUR ACCOUNTANT?

[northernladuk]

I think the key point the OP is missing is that the scale rate is a limit, not a fixed charge. So if you spend less but still claim the full scale allowance, then it's fraud, pure and simple...

And that point alone answers the OP's question and shuts this whole topic down. You claim what you spent, either via the receipt of the scale rate and away you go. No profit to be made from the taxman here.

[pennywisetrading]

I think the key point the OP is missing is that the scale rate is a limit, not a fixed charge. So if you spend less but still claim the full scale allowance, then it's fraud, pure and simple...

Umbrellas used to use scale rates for a long time to boost their client's earnings until HMRC stamped on them very hard for doing so. It's also why expenses got binned for IR35-caught workers.

The only exception I know of where you claim the scale rate regardless is trivial costs, such as newspapers, the odd coffee or calls home from a hotel or similar.

OHHHH Right!!! Now it makes sense!

See, this is what I was asking, and if the scale rate is not fixed then obviously I won't claim more than the amount spent.

All I was trying to figure out was that point, as it seemed to not make too much sense, but if it's a limit and not fixed then makes more sense.

Obviously I'm not going to claim more than I can, I wanted to understand, because who would go into contracting/open a business and risk it all for a few pounds like that?

[eek]

I think the key point the OP is missing is that the scale rate is a limit, not a fixed charge. So if you spend less but still claim the full scale allowance, then it's fraud, pure and simple...

Umbrellas used to use scale rates for a long time to boost their client's earnings until HMRC stamped on them very hard for doing so. It's also why expenses got binned for IR35-caught workers.

The only exception I know of where you claim the scale rate regardless is trivial costs, such as newspapers, the odd coffee or calls home from a hotel or similar.

It's worth looking at how the few umbrellas that still do expenses are now doing it..

They will deduct £X a day from the umbrella / assignment fee for expenses - so say £200 a week.

But will only return the amount you can provide invoices for up to that £200 and will usually pocket the difference for themselves.

Again the important thing here - is that the umbrella will only pay expenses that you can provide receipts for (mileage claims are a complete no-no and need to be done via the end of year tax return).

[northernladuk]

All I was trying to figure out was that point, as it seemed to not make too much sense, but if it's a limit and not fixed then makes more sense.

Obviously I'm not going to claim more than I can, I wanted to understand, because who would go into contracting/open a business and risk it all for a few pounds like that?

Cool story bro. Who are you trying to kid? The thread starting out with you trying to commit tax fraud and then has focused on the details of which makes you the most money. You even stated it was obvious you'd pick the highest one in post

So based on the above, there seems to be an advantage to the contractor if the cost of their accommodation is LESS than HMRC's Room rate.

You are talking utter tripe now.

[NotAllThere]

If I'm wrong, I will happily put my hands up and apologise.

You're wrong. We shall not wait for an apology. Thread locked.