Public sector IR35 consultation launched

[westtester]

I'm hoping that a boycott of public sector contract opportunities will drive home the argument that this whole approach by HMRC is folly. But I wonder how many of us will actually do it?

[MrMarkyMark]

FTFY

I'm hoping that a boycott of public sector contract opportunities will drive home the argument that this whole approach by HMRC is folly. But I wonder how many of us will actually be able to afford to do it?

[Ketto]

Turned down an extension through to the end of March at my current PS client solely because of this, start new private sector gig on Wednesday. None of the other guys here have a clue what is coming or seem overly interested when I have mentioned it. Will be interesting to see how it all pans out (from the sidelines thankfully!). The plan has more holes in it than Jeremy Corbyn's economic strategy.

[nucastle]

I've told the managers at work earlier this week, I wont be extending, and told them exactly why.

So, I've done my bit - Come October first can you spare a brother a dime.

The only way this is going to work is by people actually upping and leaving, although the people with the balls to do that, risking time on the bench and instability, are few in number.

[westtester]

Maybe when those who are staying realise that their incomes are going to take a hit, they might think again. They'll either have to go down the brolly route or start saving for a big deemed payment.

[jamesbrown]

Maybe when those who are staying realise that their incomes are going to take a hit, they might think again. They'll either have to go down the brolly route or start saving for a big deemed payment.

No saving necessary, as the deemed payment will be operated through RTI. In many cases, there will be an overpayment. For the same reason, there are going to be some shocked PS permietractors this time next year. Only then will people start walking (those leaving now are the smart ones).

[eek]

I get all that. I'm probably the worst type to get into these discussions. I'm not close enough or political enough to understand these organisations yet throw the odd bombs in from time to time that probably frustrate the serious lot.

I just struggle with comments around the deep researching to what it's members want and then say anyone can be a member and it's worthwhile purely on a financial basis. Surely that means they are going have to defend everyone against everything. Surely a narrower focus which would result in most people doing it properly winning (or not changing) with a bit of collateral damage be better than no one winning at all?

As I say I probably don't understand and am possibly doing more harm than good so I'll drop it here.

Sorry to return to this bit from last week I really was away and not spending much time online.

I think the above sums up my entire problem with the IPSE. I've continually argued that we (sadly) will need to throw some people over the side to protect the more skilled contractor. And to be honest if you are doing first line support as a contractor exactly who is getting the better side of that deal - I can safely say its not really the contractor.

It's whyI much prefer to talk to the unions at least you know what they are fighting for and why.. And with Deliveroo, uber, yodel and all the other companies at the moment trying to force things towards "fake" self employment to fit their business model you can see why momentum is supposedly heading against us...

[malvolio]

Sorry to return to this bit from last week I really was away and not spending much time online.

I think the above sums up my entire problem with the IPSE. I've continually argued that we (sadly) will need to throw some people over the side to protect the more skilled contractor. And to be honest if you are doing first line support as a contractor exactly who is getting the better side of that deal - I can safely say its not really the contractor.

It's whyI much prefer to talk to the unions at least you know what they are fighting for and why.. And with Deliveroo, uber, yodel and all the other companies at the moment trying to force things towards "fake" self employment to fit their business model you can see why momentum is supposedly heading against us...

Really don't understand lobbying, do you? Nor will you listen when it's explained by the people doing it. But hey, if it makes you happy...

Anyway IPSE have always supported the cause workers who are being forced into pseudo self-employment, since that undermines their whole argument about the difference between company owning chambermaids, BBC presenters and "self-employed" social workers and us genuine freelance contractors. On that basis, there's nobody to throw overboard. And, to challenge your other assertion from the viewpoint of someone whose been delivering IT to businesses for around 40 years, first line support is the face of the IT department and the coding world and the rest of the hyper-technical experts are actually supporting them in delivering the IT service. Nobody is any more or less important than anyone else, nor more or less deserving of support.

Finally you might like to reflect that all unions have as their stated aim the provision of equal employment rights for all workers. A laudable aim if you want to be an employee. I, and at least 20k other people, don't.

[eek]

Really don't understand lobbying, do you? Nor will you listen when it's explained by the people doing it. But hey, if it makes you happy...

Anyway IPSE have always supported the cause workers who are being forced into pseudo self-employment, since that undermines their whole argument about the difference between company owning chambermaids, BBC presenters and "self-employed" social workers and us genuine freelance contractors. On that basis, there's nobody to throw overboard. And, to challenge your other assertion from the viewpoint of someone whose been delivering IT to businesses for around 40 years, first line support is the face of the IT department and the coding world and the rest of the hyper-technical experts are actually supporting them in delivering the IT service. Nobody is any more or less important than anyone else, nor more or less deserving of support.

Finally you might like to reflect that all unions have as their stated aim the provision of equal employment rights for all workers. A laudable aim if you want to be an employee. I, and at least 20k other people, don't.

And you show once again that you don't understand how realpolitik works and the consequences of that lack of understanding when it comes to the big players in a serious game....

You were far more right on Friday than you are here. Highly skilled specialist contractors need to differentiate themselves from those who contract to either make a few more quid or because their employees want to save a few quid or the hassles of employing people.... Until and unless some group does that as a whole we are merely going to be seen as IR35 tax dodgers....

[malvolio]

And you show once again that you don't understand how realpolitik works and the consequences of that lack of understanding when it comes to the big players in a serious game....

You were far more right on Friday than you are here. Highly skilled specialist contractors need to differentiate themselves from those who contract to either make a few more quid or because their employees want to save a few quid or the hassles of employing people.... Until and unless some group does that as a whole we are merely going to be seen as IR35 tax dodgers....

OK, that's your opinion. It's not mine. Let's just leave it at that.