Reply to: Boris to Abolish Contracting

[ladymuck]

Except now the banks are banning big consultancies from using PSCs too... And maybe in time, so too will other large firms follow suit.

Of course, it will revert as you mentioned about HMRC. The Public sector has had time to figure the game out, and so too will the Private sector...

Business have had plenty of time to "figure it out". They've just chosen not to. At any time over the past couple or decades they could have moved to true B2B engagement models. The only difference now is that they have to.

[simes]

The IR35 (private sector) mess is a boon for the big consultancy firms and nothing but negative for everyone forced* down the Umbrella route..

*I say 'forced' as entire business sectors have a blanket ban on using PSC's..

Except now the banks are banning big consultancies from using PSCs too... And maybe in time, so too will other large firms follow suit.

Of course, it will revert as you mentioned about HMRC. The Public sector has had time to figure the game out, and so too will the Private sector...

[peel3000]

So the Tories pulling up the ladder after them?? Many of them used it in the past..

The IR35 (private sector) mess is a boon for the big consultancy firms and nothing but negative for everyone forced* down the Umbrella route..
The umbrella companies and agencies are lining up to take advantage!

As a kick in the teeth, I find out that many of HMRC's contractors are explicitly outside IR35. Oh and they sold their premises to an offshore company - only to rent it back to themselves..
...as a tax wheeze..
You couldn't make it up..

The whole situation is grossly unfair AND pretty depressing..

Cheers,

N

*I say 'forced' as entire business sectors have a blanket ban on using PSC's..

[Manic]

Sorry I am back to the UK after 12 years away.

I read this to mean that if your role is for a single company then you either have to be on their PAYE scheme or an umbrella companies PAYE scheme.

So if I temp or undertake any form of exclusive role I have to be paid via PAYE one way or another.

If I work for 2, 3 or more companies maybe a few days per week for each then I am still able to be considered a consultant - in which case I can remain self employed via my own business? Is that the distinction being made?

I work as an SEO professional - my plan is to build up my own client porfolio but at the moment I am unemployed and looking for a job to get re-established back in the UK. I want to setup my own company and move towards my objective but meanwhile want to work but remain compliant with whatever the new rules are

Any input appreciated.

Mark

No, the determination is made on a contract by contract basis. You might find that 1 of the three is outside but the other two inside in your example.

[technobabble]

Contracting

Sorry I am back to the UK after 12 years away.

I read this to mean that if your role is for a single company then you either have to be on their PAYE scheme or an umbrella companies PAYE scheme.

So if I temp or undertake any form of exclusive role I have to be paid via PAYE one way or another.

If I work for 2, 3 or more companies maybe a few days per week for each then I am still able to be considered a consultant - in which case I can remain self employed via my own business? Is that the distinction being made?

I work as an SEO professional - my plan is to build up my own client porfolio but at the moment I am unemployed and looking for a job to get re-established back in the UK. I want to setup my own company and move towards my objective but meanwhile want to work but remain compliant with whatever the new rules are

Any input appreciated.

Mark

[JohntheBike]

I see the guys in the white coats have finally arrived.

nah, they were in black and had a reverse Babylonian good luck charm on their sleeves.

[Paralytic]

"and then they came for me"

I see the guys in the white coats have finally arrived.

[JohntheBike]

If they are insisting that contractors have the same - or indeed worse - tax arrangements than salaried employees I am struggling to think what more they could do!

"and then they came for me"

[SussexSeagull]

If they are insisting that contractors have the same - or indeed worse - tax arrangements than salaried employees I am struggling to think what more they could do!

[JohntheBike]

Very hard to know what that really means. But from the context of the section, it sounds very much like the potential aim of any possible bill would be to protect workers from unscrupulous employers. I’d guess this is trying to stop “gig economy” workers from being utterly screwed by Uber, Deliveroo etc. I’m not seeing anything here that scares the crap out of me. Could be wrong of course!

it sounds very much like the potential aim of any possible bill would be to protect workers from unscrupulous employers. I’d guess this is trying to stop “gig economy” workers from being utterly screwed by Uber, Deliveroo etc.

I would tend to agree, based on a similar statement from my Labour MP on Labour party policy.

[Amanensia]

Very hard to know what that really means. But from the context of the section, it sounds very much like the potential aim of any possible bill would be to protect workers from unscrupulous employers. I’d guess this is trying to stop “gig economy” workers from being utterly screwed by Uber, Deliveroo etc. I’m not seeing anything here that scares the crap out of me. Could be wrong of course!

[matzie]

Sorry guys but I've got some bad news.

The text reported on the dodgy site originally linked to was not in the Queen's speech as she originally delivered it, nor was it in the transcript.

However it IS in the background briefing, on page 66.

"We will increase fairness and flexibility in the labour market by stopping employers and workers experiencing significantly different outcomes from flexible forms of working"

PDF source: https://assets.publishing.service.go...Pack_2019_.pdf

It's game over, man, game over IMHO.

[cojak]

It's quoted here:

Queen’s Speech: pensions, employment and airline insolvency changes | Accountancy Daily

But I don't know if this is chicken or egg.

Lazy journalism...

[malvolio]

Hold on. Not a grain of truth in it. Written by Gerry so not at all surprising.

Read the Queen's Speech properly and you will ot find anything to justify this article.

[webberg]

Probably chicken as I see that the accountancy article was published a day after the original link above.