Reply to: So what do our resident web heads think of this?

[pzz76077]

That is exactly the idea of unicode, but most DNS implementations ( Bind, MS DNS Server etc ) do not support unicode as standard.

There are a number of local hacks available that will work for individual DNS servers but they are not consitent, and they only work for those users who's DNS is configured to use them. The vast majority of DNS services provided by ISP's, Tier 1,2 and 3 providers and individual organizations *do not* support unicode.

The proposal for IDN ( International Domain Names ) now passed and about to be implemented will effectively mean that every DNS server in the world will need to provide partial unicode support as standard with no further action required by the client.

I say partial because it only applies to the unicode equivalent of the latin alphanumerics, it will not include unicode equivalents of non alphanumeric characters not currently permitted in domain names.

Any binary string can be used in a DNS name. (RFC 2181)

Even Microsoft have supported non Roman DNS queries since 2005 so their web site sais and they are always last!

PZZ

[xoggoth]

I used Babel Fish to inspect my website in Korean yesterday. Needless to say it was still totally brilliant.

[AtW]

That's the whole point of this process: the idea is that a small number of IDN ccTLDs will be created, so that implementors can find out what needs to be done to make this work, and then do it.

Who will be updating firmware in old consumer routers that would not accept non-latin characters for domains? Even if all software DNS servers are updated there will be shredload of hardware that won't work with it, I can't see that working well at all.

[NickFitz]

Oh yes we can..

This is not so much as supporting unicode IMHO, but changing domain verification code - it should in theory reject it if non-latin characters used, who'll be updating old routers etc?

That's the whole point of this process: the idea is that a small number of IDN ccTLDs will be created, so that implementors can find out what needs to be done to make this work, and then do it.

Initially, development focused on enabling the introduction of IDNs as registrations under existing TLDs (which has been available under technical standards since 2003), but now focus has shifted to broadening the repertoire of characters available for use in top-level strings as well.

- http://www.icann.org/en/topics/idn/

You're six years behind anyway

[AtW]

I'm sure you and scurine army can knock up a solution over a cup of tea and a few acorns

Oh yes we can..

This is not so much as supporting unicode IMHO, but changing domain verification code - it should in theory reject it if non-latin characters used, who'll be updating old routers etc?

[DaveB]

I can't see it working reliably anytime soon - they are insane to have agreed this to happen in the first place. SKA will have to support them though

I'm sure you and scurine army can knock up a solution over a cup of tea and a few acorns

[AtW]

I can't see it working reliably anytime soon - they are insane to have agreed this to happen in the first place. SKA will have to support them though

[NickFitz]

The spec for Internationalised Domain Names (IDNs) has been stable for ages now, IIRC. What ICANN announced was a fast track process to get a limited number of new ccTLDs in action, so that we can actually get it working in TRW:

With the approval of the IDNC Final Report by the ICANN Board of Directors, ICANN is now at a transition point, focusing on developing implementable solutions to the IDNC recommendations.

- http://www.icann.org/en/topics/idn/fast-track/

[DaveB]

I thought the whole idea of Unicode was that you can use any character of any language you like, and whatever character you typed would generate the binary equivalent, thus what you type or see in your browser address line does not have to be in any particular language. From what I can see this seems to be true. I certainly remember seeing Japanese being typed as URL's last time I wast there.

PZZ

That is exactly the idea of unicode, but most DNS implementations ( Bind, MS DNS Server etc ) do not support unicode as standard.

There are a number of local hacks available that will work for individual DNS servers but they are not consitent, and they only work for those users who's DNS is configured to use them. The vast majority of DNS services provided by ISP's, Tier 1,2 and 3 providers and individual organizations *do not* support unicode.

The proposal for IDN ( International Domain Names ) now passed and about to be implemented will effectively mean that every DNS server in the world will need to provide partial unicode support as standard with no further action required by the client.

I say partial because it only applies to the unicode equivalent of the latin alphanumerics, it will not include unicode equivalents of non alphanumeric characters not currently permitted in domain names.

[AtW]

I thought the whole idea of Unicode was that you can use any character of any language you like, and whatever character you typed would generate the binary equivalent, thus what you type or see in your browser address line does not have to be in any particular language. From what I can see this seems to be true. I certainly remember seeing Japanese being typed as URL's last time I wast there.

Unicode is unicode, DNS system is DNS system - it did not support universally Unicode (until now it seems). This means people could hack their own systems, but they won't work everywhere like proper DNS should.

[pzz76077]

So it would not work with people from other countries that don't use "their DNS"?

I thought the whole idea of Unicode was that you can use any character of any language you like, and whatever character you typed would generate the binary equivalent, thus what you type or see in your browser address line does not have to be in any particular language. From what I can see this seems to be true. I certainly remember seeing Japanese being typed as URL's last time I wast there.

PZZ

[AtW]

Works fine apparently, just need to use their DNS.

PZZ

So it would not work with people from other countries that don't use "their DNS"?

[pzz76077]

It was only available if you had additional DNS software on client side, it would not work from other places - new approach would solve it completely.

Works fine apparently, just need to use their DNS.

PZZ

[AtW]

As I said, it has been available for a while.

It was only available if you had additional DNS software on client side, it would not work from other places - new approach would solve it completely.

[AtW]

But not that much time....

That's more time than I got before sending off VAT return for last quarter...