Reply to: PS Bodies unite to try to shelve IR35 plans

[RonBW]

It's interesting to see who is thanking / liking which replies....

[DaveB]

Shared on a locums forum (although it is a bit there!)

Wrapped it up in a short article on LinkdIn.

Already done one piece on the IR35 changes that got a good response, so tagged it as a follow up on that.

[teapot418]

I'm not oblivious I just know that certain things can be fought and certain things are going to occur regardless (it's why I fought hard on the PSC expenses issue but not the public sector changes).

Now if you want to be useful take that NHS letter I linked to earlier and send it to a few people. Spreading that far and wide would be a better use of our time today than arguing and pointless point scoring here.

Shared on a locums forum (although it is a bit there!)

[eek]

You seem to have interpreted my post as some kind of personal thing aimed at you - it was not aimed at any specific individual.

Nope I just thought it was worth replying to.

It's interesting to see who is thanking / liking which replies....

[RonBW]

1) nope - couldn't argue that - once people were tricked into those schemes there was no argument to support them... What I have done since 2002 is state that joining a scheme is a bad idea and will lead to pain.
2) believe me I argued but its a annoyingly small jump in logic from 3 month temp contract (you can't claim expenses) to a 3 month temp contract via an umbrella - it was a losing battle. What we did win was the fact personal service companies were not hit by the same rules - the IR35 amendment was a clue to the next plan but wasn't part of the initial discussion document.
3) Where? I've not seen a direct attack on bum on seat contractors.
4) Hmm - everyone has complained about this but HMG isn't listening...

You seem to have interpreted my post as some kind of personal thing aimed at you - it was not aimed at any specific individual.

[eek]

Our symbol should be a frog sitting cozily in a warm bath, totally oblivious to the temperature being increased slowly but surely.
(well, not so slowly now)

I'm not oblivious I just know that certain things can be fought and certain things are going to occur regardless (it's why I fought hard on the PSC expenses issue but not the public sector changes).

Now if you want to be useful take that NHS letter I linked to earlier and send it to a few people. Spreading that far and wide would be a better use of our time today than arguing and pointless point scoring here.

[eek]

First they came for the loan users, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I was not a loan user.
Then they came for the umbrella companies, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not an umbrella user.
Then they came for the bum on seat contractors, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not a BoS contractor.
Then they came for the public sector workers, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I'm smart enough to be able to move to private sector easily.

Then it was March 8th 2017, and I'm not celebrating any more.

1) nope - couldn't argue that - once people were tricked into those schemes there was no argument to support them... What I have done since 2002 is state that joining a scheme is a bad idea and will lead to pain.
2) believe me I argued but its a annoyingly small jump in logic from 3 month temp contract (you can't claim expenses) to a 3 month temp contract via an umbrella - it was a losing battle. What we did win was the fact personal service companies were not hit by the same rules - the IR35 amendment was a clue to the next plan but wasn't part of the initial discussion document.
3) Where? I've not seen a direct attack on bum on seat contractors.
4) Hmm - everyone has complained about this but HMG isn't listening...

[DotasScandal]

This is how the government implements most actions that would otherwise bring protest or legal challenge. They slowly establish new norms so as not to trigger the realisation of loss of liberty. There is a reason why the tortoise is the symbol of the Fabian Society.

Our symbol should be a frog sitting cozily in a warm bath, totally oblivious to the temperature being increased slowly but surely.
(well, not so slowly now)

[DotasScandal]

First they came for the loan users, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I was not a loan user.
Then they came for the umbrella companies, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not an umbrella user.
Then they came for the bum on seat contractors, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not a BoS contractor.
Then they came for the public sector workers, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I'm smart enough to be able to move to private sector easily.

Then it was March 8th 2017, and I'm not celebrating any more.

Spot-on summary of the UK Contractor's mentality, thank you.

Of course, the above can be broken down into further categories, pretty much ad infinitum.
Contractors in this country are always, ALWAYS happy to splinter into ever-tiner factions, as long as it gives them a feeling of superiority oveir their "lesser" fellow contractors. Nowhere is this better demonstrated than on these forums.

[northernladuk]

I didn't say I was any good at it

[breaktwister]

First they came for the loan users, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I was not a loan user.
Then they came for the umbrella companies, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not an umbrella user.
Then they came for the bum on seat contractors, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I am not a BoS contractor.
Then they came for the public sector workers, and I celebrated - I was left alone because I'm smart enough to be able to move to private sector easily.

Then it was March 8th 2017, and I'm not celebrating any more.

This is how the government implements most actions that would otherwise bring protest or legal challenge. They slowly establish new norms so as not to trigger the realisation of loss of liberty. There is a reason why the tortoise is the symbol of the Fabian Society.

[teapot418]

Me too.......

[barrydidit]

I got it all in with a AK against a guy with AQ a couple of nights ago and he river'd the Q. Last night on the final table I shove 4 BB with KK and a guy turns A3 and rivers the A. Why is it always on the river?... but yes. I would't dare post any of that on a poker forum lol...

You had an ace queen by the river a couple of nights ago? I wouldn't have posted it here either if I were you.

[northernladuk]

Who's "we"?

Personally, I try to be constructive and helpful regardless of how new or ill-informed the poster is.

Me too.......

[northernladuk]

and I thought poker forums were bad

I got it all in with a AK against a guy with AQ a couple of nights ago and he river'd the Q. Last night on the final table I shove 4 BB with KK and a guy turns A3 and rivers the A. Why is it always on the river?... but yes. I would't dare post any of that on a poker forum lol...