Reply to: Poor Raymond :(

[Churchill]

Dozens of Tibettan monks can't be wrong.

How many do they get to the gallon?

[Notascooby]

Two things smell of fish and one of them is fish

Smelliest thing in the sea......

A kippers fanny.

[Notascooby]

Blah, blah, blah - Give it up, you're wasting your breath.

The plain fact is that successive governments have let in millions of immigrants, to do the work cheaper and garner their votes (the main reason no doubt). The inevitable result is mllions of indigenous people on benefits, and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

Whilst there's no doubt been corrupt practices in illegal immigrant work squads, I think this is utter tulip.

Its more an attitude of "I'm not lowering myself to do that job" which others will happily do for a reasonable minimum wage - that its showhow better to complain that there's no suitable high paying jobs for people with no skills than taking an unskilled job.

[DodgyAgent]

That sounds a bit fishy to me!

Two things smell of fish and one of them is fish

[Churchill]

Set a man on fire and he is warm for life

Just so long has he pays for his carbon emissions!

[TimberWolf]

Give a man a fish and he can feed himself for the day.
Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for life.

Set a man on fire and he is warm for life

[Churchill]

Give a man a fish and he can feed himself for the day.
Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for life.
Some people are content to be just given fish & have no interest in learning to fish.
Their offspring become the same; dependent on being given fish.
What happens when they are not given fish?
They then want to learn how to fish.
The less you do, the less you want to do.
Here endeth the lesson.

That sounds a bit fishy to me!

[SteelyDan]

Give a man a fish and he can feed himself for the day.
Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for life.
Some people are content to be just given fish & have no interest in learning to fish.
Their offspring become the same; dependent on being given fish.
What happens when they are not given fish?
They then want to learn how to fish.
The less you do, the less you want to do.
Here endeth the lesson.

[BrilloPad]

The plain fact is that successive governments have let in millions of immigrants, to do the work cheaper and garner their votes (the main reason no doubt). The inevitable result is mllions of indigenous people on benefits, and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

Another good reason to leave the EU and become part of an Europe free trade region.

[OwlHoot]

All good points.

My solution is make them work for benefits and make benefits insufficient to afford Sky etc.

'Benefits cheats' exposed as HALF of all claimants fail to turn up for work placements | Mail Online

we might even halve the benefit bill this way.

They have no incentive to retrain or look for work as DA says make them.


Looking at those figures they have about £150 = £200 a week non essential expenditure. 200 B&H £65 , Booze 24 cans of Stella £24 , Sky £15, Mobile £32 (we as a family of 4 go through less than £20 a month), Entertainment and £90 of undisclosed considering as they are on benefits they get reduced school meals and trip costs looks suspect. So £10,000 less is not a struggle. ...

Blah, blah, blah - Give it up, you're wasting your breath.

The plain fact is that successive governments have let in millions of immigrants, to do the work cheaper and garner their votes (the main reason no doubt). The inevitable result is mllions of indigenous people on benefits, and there's nothing anyone can do about it.

[vetran]

Rich Raymond, better off than most.

All good points.

My solution is make them work for benefits and make benefits insufficient to afford Sky etc.

'Benefits cheats' exposed as HALF of all claimants fail to turn up for work placements | Mail Online

we might even halve the benefit bill this way.

They have no incentive to retrain or look for work as DA says make them.


Looking at those figures they have about £150 = £200 a week non essential expenditure. 200 B&H £65 , Booze 24 cans of Stella £24 , Sky £15, Mobile £32 (we as a family of 4 go through less than £20 a month), Entertainment and £90 of undisclosed considering as they are on benefits they get reduced school meals and trip costs looks suspect. So £10,000 less is not a struggle.


Not sure why the Tories are pursuing the cap, it would be easier and more effective to manage it as there are only 15,000 over the cap level. Just tell the benefits office / job centre they get a bonus for everyone they get below the cap and fired for every 100 still on. Pretty much what private industry would do.

Change the rules so you can move claimants out of expensive areas and insist same sex kids share rooms. We shared when we were young and we were never on benefits, many of my colleagues in large families also shared with their siblings. Not everyone can afford a 5 - 7 bedroom house even if their parents both work.

Of course we can afford it:

Benefit payouts will exceed income tax revenue - Telegraph

[xoggoth]

Cruel to be kind that'll fix it

Even relatively normal people have some time in their lives where nothing is going right. Easy to fall into a rut, sometimes we all need a bit of a push to get back on track.

[d000hg]

Remove the welfare and make working the path of least resistance people will take it - no one is going to sit around for long doing nothing if they have'nt got any food.

That is true, but then you get the opposite problem - people slogging their guts out to stay 1 meal ahead of starvation, and many of them failing to do so. No time for education or anything because your entire waking life is spent rummaging through bins or begging for coppers.

I would imagine crowds of starving street urchins are slightly worse than groups of chavs. Maybe not my much though.

[DodgyAgent]

Since I think the WS is a good thing in principle, and that [many] people are lazy in principle, the situation we find ourselves in doesn't strike me as surprising.

I'm not sure I agree about the vested interest thing. Clearly many jobs revolve around it, but then fixing it and administering it properly would also provide a huge number of jobs. As a political tool I suppose so - but then "being tough on benefits scroungers" is a good vote-winner for the middle classes who think anyone on benefits is a scrounger.

I don't envy anyone trying to fix the system.

I do not think it is a question of laziness. People take the path of least resistance and if the path of least resistance is to live off welfare they will take it. Remove the welfare and make working the path of least resistance people will take it - no one is going to sit around for long doing nothing if they have'nt got any food.
The vested interest is not necessarily a conscious thing just an acquiescence and an assumption that voting labour is virtuous because it supports welfare. The assumption that giving poor people money for being poor is a good thing is wrong.

Cruel to be kind that'll fix it (where's Jim when you need him?)

[DodgyAgent]

disincentivising (is that a word?).

Agentspeke