Reply to: Boris saves the Union from potentially devastating referendum!

[shaunbhoy]

She really is the worst sort of disingenuous self-indulgent weasel.
The last Indy Referendum largely fell apart on the basis that there was no consensus on what currency would be used.

It seemed to hinge upon some notional whimsy that Scotland could somehow become the next "Norway", living high on the hog on untapped oil and gas revenue. Sheer nonsense, and it will be interesting to see just how she meets her ridiculously extravagant environmental targets whilst going down that route of financing her "vision".
Not sure how well that approach will play out with the Greens, a partner she is strapped into to get a majority in the Scottish Parliament.

Then we come to the absurd contention that Scotland will simply be allowed to somehow seamlessly hop back into the EU. I've no doubt that the Spanish will be champing at the bit to veto that suggestion.

Maybe Boris should allow her the Referendum but insist upon the proviso that the winning margin has to be at least 60-40 to make the whole matter conclusive enough to stand up to future scrutiny.
You know it makes sense.

[d000hg]

Jesus, Mary and Joseph and the wee donkey. You really are unbelievably stupid !

That's quite the compliment coming from you. Thanks testie.

[TestMangler]

The local electorate didn't want it anywhere near as much until the SNP and similar inflamed the issue. Basic rabble-rousing like BNP/UKIP/Trump all engaged in.

Jesus, Mary and Joseph and the wee donkey. You really are unbelievably stupid !

[d000hg]

The local electorate didn't want it anywhere near as much until the SNP and similar inflamed the issue. Basic rabble-rousing like BNP/UKIP/Trump all engaged in.

[ladymuck]

Independence has become "a thing" because it's clear that Westminster has very little time for those parts of the UK outside the M25 and South East. This goes for all political parties. Policies aren't conceived in manner that is truly inclusive. So now you have Scotland wanting to go their own way, Wales want more devolution and parts of the North of England are demanding more and more devolved powers to manage things locally.

I think it would be a great shame if Scotland went their own way but I can completely understand why. You may not like Sturgeon and the SNP but they are Scotland first and that's what the local electorate wanted.

[d000hg]

Hard to see this going away in the next 10 years. Legality nor not, how long can the conservatives just ignore the issue? Do they hope they can wait out the current separationist surge when Sturgeon leaves?

Like brexit, something's got to give at some point I feel. It would be nice for Westminster to see the EU's side of Brexit if an independence vote goes though.

[vetran]

And when they got tax raising powers they just added in another tax band so that 51% of the population would be paying like 20p less a month.

Then they could all robotically scream "THIS BENEFITS THE MAJORITY OF SCOTS LIKE NURSE AND TEACHERS" when they talk about it.

High earners get hammered and unsurprisingly tax take has fallen. Everything is about appeasing a majority in the short term despite knowing it will be detrimental long term.

yep hence a costed document.

[minestrone]

And when they got tax raising powers they just added in another tax band so that 51% of the population would be paying like 20p less a month.

Then they could all robotically scream "THIS BENEFITS THE MAJORITY OF SCOTS LIKE NURSE AND TEACHERS" when they talk about it.

High earners get hammered and unsurprisingly tax take has fallen. Everything is about appeasing a majority in the short term despite knowing it will be detrimental long term.

[minestrone]

The increased spending and tax raising was, I believe, a deliberate trap that the nationalists fell into. Now that tax raised per capita has dropped below the UK average ( it was quite a bit above ) Scotland now relies upon the extra cash as public spending is set up to be significantly higher.

And it's not good for the general economy. Let's say I go out to look for a local design business, most are just grinding out stuff for arms length public sector groups like tourist boards and health boards. It's not tied to results so most of them product sub standard work.

[vetran]

It's not about money it's about democracy. I have to laugh when I (joked) that Jersey should be returned to the French, people pointed out that self determination with a democratic vote should define sovereignty, not geography or history.

The Scottish people deserve to be heard. A LOT has changed since the last freedom vote.

Let them cast their vote. If it's a no to independence, then let it be for at least a decade.

I have no problem with the voting but to avoid another Brexit style decade of bickering lets have a costed plan and one of the first costs being Scotland paying for the vote which can be internationally verified. Then ten years transition with the rest of the UK removing all the jobs up there positioned to keep the Scots happy. British civil servants won't stay there, neither will submarine & defence bases.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/u...20improvements.

I would like them to stay but join us in building a better UK, no time for whining and Sturgeon is not their saviour, she & Salmond have had enough power to make a difference, its all negative so far.

[_V_]

It's not about money it's about democracy. I have to laugh when I (joked) that Jersey should be returned to the French, people pointed out that self determination with a democratic vote should define sovereignty, not geography or history.

The Scottish people deserve to be heard. A LOT has changed since the last freedom vote.

Let them cast their vote. If it's a no to independence, then let it be for at least a decade.

[vetran]

you really deserve to live in Slough, you really do.
a true jingoistic little Englander pencilneck.
oh, and a total tosser.

Actually I apologise for the Scottish refugee comment, it is probably a little rude.

So do you agree with setting out a validated transition document before a referendum? As it is your second go at a referendum you can fund it from Scottish taxes?

Personally I would like to see Sturgeon to run Scotland properly before she drags the Scottish into independence and probable poverty.

So far she hasn't really excelled.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulat...n-uk-countries

Scots can expect to live fewer years than the English, Welsh or Northern Irish. Since the pre-devolution period, life expectancy for Scottish men increased at a broadly similar rate to that in the other UK nations (by roughly 4½ years, which is slightly less than England but slightly more than Wales). Life expectancy for Scottish women has fallen somewhat further behind that in England.

https://inews.co.uk/news/scotland/pi...e-maths-370433

Pisa results 2019: Scotland records worst-ever performance in science and maths

The Pisa results saw Scotland achieve its lowest scores in maths and science since it first took part in the survey almost 20 years ago

https://theconversation.com/scottish...he-data-150339

Scotland spends considerably more (per child) on pre-tertiary education than any region in England (£6,191 per child against £5,216 in England – and the latter includes the London weighting).

https://www.beltramiandcompany.co.uk...ful-urban-area

A recent study by the Institute for Economics and Peace reveals that, while the UK is 11% less violent than a decade ago, Glasgow is the least peaceful of all the major urban areas, with London ranked as the second most violent.

Scotland, according to the figures, has the highest homicide rate of the four home nations. It also has the highest violent crime rate, at almost 1,600 violent crimes per 100,000 people; this is almost double the violent crime rate in Wales, the most peaceful home nation. When compared against the other 11 UK regions, Scotland is the second most violent region, beaten to the bottom only by London.

The report found that Glasgow has major issues with gangs and knife crime. Recent studies have found that up to 3,500 members between the ages of 11 and 23 have joined one of the 170 street gangs within the city’s borders. Furthermore, the homicide rate for Glasgow males between 10 and 29 is comparable to rates of Argentina, Costa Rica and Lithuania.

This is after 20 years of devolution and higher per capita spending.

[AtW]

Do you believe Scotland leaving would be a success?

It certainly will be for the goal of gaining Independence.

Next!

[vetran]

you really deserve to live in Slough, you really do.
a true jingoistic little Englander pencilneck.
oh, and a total tosser.

oh dear my sense of humour has upset someone.

You don't know any Scottish expats down here for work?

Do you believe Scotland leaving would be a success?

[OwlHoot]

Scottish Twitter users 'shocked' after discovering the word 'outwith' is only used in Scotland - Daily Record

I didn't know that. I think the space was added for me when I typed it.

I had a feeling it was more of a Scots usage.

There's another similar word that used to mean the same thing "without". Obviously these days that usually means "lacking", and most people would be baffled by seeing it used to mean "outside", except maybe whe combined with its opposite, e.g. "They searched the whole building, both within and without".