Reply to: Trumponomics

[VectraMan]

We end up back at the anecdotes of the Aldi supermarket that advertised their usual (limited hours. designed for benefits) jobs which all went to freshly arrived Eastern Europeans. Perfectly valid, perfectly legal but annoyed the locals enough that the voting turnout went from 2% at the previous election (police commissioner) to 78% with the clerks having to tell 50yr+ people what to do as they had never voted before.

I'm not saying that the people above are going to do well out of Brexit but you can see why when given a vote that meant they could say no more of the same, they voted no more of the same....

The problem is they think they voted for less globalisation, less immigration and more protection for jobs whereas they've actually voted for more globalisation, probably no change in immigration, and less protection for jobs.

And the political elite are still running everything.

[BlasterBates]

Almost all the evidence is that non-skilled immigration had only a small effect on lowering wages.
I suspect that we'll see unemployment rise and wages fall if a hard Brexit came in, simply because there'll be fewer jobs to go around, as foreign companies leave. And lower tax take to fund public sector jobs. Basically less economic activity all round.
Some on the dole or food bank queue of the future might look back with nostalgia to the days when the only thing annoying them was the Polish food shop on the high street.

If you restrict lower skilled immigration, that restricts the growth of higher skilled jobs which actually has the effect that people end up in lower paid jobs. One Engineer needs 12 lower skilled people in various support positions. Someone has to clean the office.

eg Fruit farms in Boston.

Eastern Europeans can't come in, so some fruit farms close and the unemployed fruit farm employees go and work in the unskilled jobs at the remaining fruit farms.



A real case was in the US where the US authorities busted a factory employing low skilled illegal immigrants. The illegal immigrants were either deported or left, the factory closed and all the indigenous Americans lost their jobs because the economy was devastated. After a couple of years they opened a new factory and brought in legal Somali immigrants.

[eek]

Almost all the evidence is that non-skilled immigration had only a small effect on lowering wages.
I suspect that we'll see unemployment rise and wages fall if a hard Brexit came in, simply because there'll be fewer jobs to go around, as foreign companies leave. And lower tax take to fund public sector jobs. Basically less economic activity all round.
Some on the dole or food bank queue of the future might look back with nostalgia to the days when the only thing annoying them was the Polish food shop on the high street.

We end up back at the anecdotes of the Aldi supermarket that advertised their usual (limited hours. designed for benefits) jobs which all went to freshly arrived Eastern Europeans. Perfectly valid, perfectly legal but annoyed the locals enough that the voting turnout went from 2% at the previous election (police commissioner) to 78% with the clerks having to tell 50yr+ people what to do as they had never voted before.

I'm not saying that the people above are going to do well out of Brexit but you can see why when given a vote that meant they could say no more of the same, they voted no more of the same....

As for the where you go from here. As with the industrial revolution, the world is going to change. How it changes is unknown....

[d000hg]

What place do emoticons and txt-speak have in a post about using good English in forum threads?




HTH

[vetran]

if you make a post insulting another posters intelligence or ability you should really read your post thoroughly.

I wanna be a grammar NAZI!


BTW Sue is a grown up, she is pretty good at defending herself.

[d000hg]

Come on, every road is a dead end.

[sasguru]

A better answer would be not allowing those with no skills to come from Eastern Europe to provide unbeatable competition to that 50%... Its remarkable how much the Brexit margin matched both the rate of immigration and the rate of austerity inflicted.

Almost all the evidence is that non-skilled immigration had only a small effect on lowering wages.
I suspect that we'll see unemployment rise and wages fall if a hard Brexit came in, simply because there'll be fewer jobs to go around, as foreign companies leave. And lower tax take to fund public sector jobs. Basically less economic activity all round.
Some on the dole or food bank queue of the future might look back with nostalgia to the days when the only thing annoying them was the Polish food shop on the high street.

[eek]

whereas you only have difficulty with grammar?

[vetran]

Don't be mean like DA he can read but he doesn't understand what he's reading.

whereas you only have difficulty with grammar?

[SueEllen]

Maybe learn to read before you feel ready to get into arguments with the grown-ups eh?

Don't be mean like DA he can read but he doesn't understand what he's reading.

[d000hg]

It's comical how the two most blatant virtue signalers on CUK make such a big song and dance when pulled up on it.

Nobody has been pulled up on it in this thread, we're just mocking DA for using a millennial term and thinking it makes him look clever

Also, I don't recall dodgy saying he thought Trump was an idiot. So it looks like you're putting words into peoples' mouths.

He is an idiot

Maybe learn to read before you feel ready to get into arguments with the grown-ups eh?

[OwlHoot]

Saving you the effort of having to make a reasoned, evidence-based argument which is handy because let's face it, you're not very good at reasoning and frequently there is no evidence to back up the argument you want to make

Trump is still an idiot though at least we seem to agree on something.

It's comical how the two most blatant virtue signalers on CUK make such a big song and dance when pulled up on it.

Also, I don't recall dodgy saying he thought Trump was an idiot. So it looks like you're putting words into peoples' mouths.

[eek]

I don't disagree. Overall there's growth, but it's concentrated in large cities which specialise in the latest knowledge industries.

This is a result of the destruction of local manufacturing in both the UK and the US and explains, to a large extent, both Brexit and Trump.
But I've posted about this before - it's the elephant in the room - what on earth do you do about the 50% of people with an IQ of less than 100 in a knowledge economy?
Of all Western countries only Germany has managed to solve this problem, perhaps because it has many more family owned paternalistic manufacturing enterprises that have an interest in maintaining strong local economies.

Not destroy manufacturing 20 years ago....

Being more serious I actually don't think that's the problem here. A better answer would be not allowing those with no skills to come from Eastern Europe to provide unbeatable competition to that 50%... Its remarkable how much the Brexit margin matched both the rate of immigration and the rate of austerity inflicted.

[d000hg]

You really should stop using the words "virtue signalling" to virtue signal to your fellow cretins, you tedious, tedious twunt.

He heard the phrase somewhere and thinks it makes him sound edgy and clever - like a child who learns a new phrase and uses it about a hundred times a day, the only difference being the child realises after a week this is dull and moves on to something new.

I love the phrase virtue signalling. It says in two words what would otherwise require several paragraphs of reason/evidenced based argument to make

Saving you the effort of having to make a reasoned, evidence-based argument which is handy because let's face it, you're not very good at reasoning and frequently there is no evidence to back up the argument you want to make

Trump is still an idiot though at least we seem to agree on something.

[sasguru]

Depends what you are looking at. Outside of the growth areas (the coasts, part of the south) the us is in a recession (in the same way the U.K. is if you look at GDP per capita rather than overall).

I don't disagree. Overall there's growth, but it's concentrated in large cities which specialise in the latest knowledge industries.

This is a result of the destruction of local manufacturing in both the UK and the US and explains, to a large extent, both Brexit and Trump.
But I've posted about this before - it's the elephant in the room - what on earth do you do about the 50% of people with an IQ of less than 100 in a knowledge economy?
Of all Western countries only Germany has managed to solve this problem, perhaps because it has many more family owned paternalistic manufacturing enterprises that have an interest in maintaining strong local economies.