Reply to: Approaching companies about possibility of changing perm role to contract

[philgo]

We are also going to have to be to differ on that one.

on another post then as this is not the topic. All I'm saying is let's see what OP gets as answers. It 's also very naif to think that this is only a question of inside/outside role where it can be also a question of headcount / recruitment strategy for the company

[northernladuk]

Indeed it appears difficult to change a contract terms from a perm to outside / inside contract role. It's also a different headcount for the company. Then I however think that naivity is sometimes very good in business as it usually allows you to think out of the box and get huge benefits. So I'm curious to hear feedback from the naiv OP's question.

We are also going to have to be to differ on that one.

[philgo]

I certainly don't read that in to it. It's a possibility but the simplicity of the question tells me not.

This statement explains his thinking..



He's just wondering if he could convince an employer with a perm job open to take him on as an outside contractor instead. That shows a level of naivity at best. If that was the case and it can be done then it would be standard practice for us all to apply for every perm job and do the same... but it's not and they won't.

Indeed it appears difficult to change a contract terms from a perm to outside / inside contract role. It's also a different headcount for the company. Then I however think that naivity is sometimes very good in business as it usually allows you to think out of the box and get huge benefits. So I'm curious to hear feedback from the naiv OP's question.

[northernladuk]

Possibly, though I think it was their wording rather than their thinking.

From reading through the responses after questioning I think they are not looking to like for like so the OP goes in as a contractor to replace a perm position, I don't think that is what they're are thinking.

Well we will have to beg to differ then because the wording 'I'm asking if it's worth getting them to consider whether they could fill the role quicker by changing the terms.' is as clear as it can be for me. They are asking if they'll take on a contractor instead of a perm to do the same job. All they are changing is the terms of the engagement. Not a chance that can be outside.

[GregRickshaw]

I certainly don't read that in to it. It's a possibility but the simplicity of the question tells me not.

This statement explains his thinking..



He's just wondering if he could convince an employer with a perm job open to take him on as an outside contractor instead. That shows a level of naivity at best. If that was the case and it can be done then it would be standard practice for us all to apply for every perm job and do the same... but it's not and they won't.

Possibly, though I think it was their wording rather than their thinking.

From reading through the responses after questioning I think they are not looking to like for like so the OP goes in as a contractor to replace a perm position, I don't think that is what they're are thinking.

[northernladuk]

Isn't the OP thinking of pitching/bidding for the work? Filling a capacity gap until the permie found?

I certainly don't read that in to it. It's a possibility but the simplicity of the question tells me not.

This statement explains his thinking..

I'm asking if it's worth getting them to consider whether they could fill the role quicker by changing the terms.

He's just wondering if he could convince an employer with a perm job open to take him on as an outside contractor instead. That shows a level of naivity at best. If that was the case and it can be done then it would be standard practice for us all to apply for every perm job and do the same... but it's not and they won't.

[GregRickshaw]

For some reason no one has stated the obvious here. A perm role cannot become an outside contract. If they are converting a role it has to be inside. It's the whole point of IR35.

There 'could' be a way of doing it but if the OP thinks a perm role can become outside then I suspect it's going to be too difficult for them.

Isn't the OP thinking of pitching/bidding for the work? Filling a capacity gap until the permie found?

[northernladuk]

For some reason no one has stated the obvious here. A perm role cannot become an outside contract. If they are converting a role it has to be inside. It's the whole point of IR35.

There 'could' be a way of doing it but if the OP thinks a perm role can become outside then I suspect it's going to be too difficult for them.

[philgo]

Yes, precisely those that I've seen listed for a while but are still unfilled, I've seen more than a few recently.

does not hurt to try I guess - let us know how you get on !

[GregRickshaw]

Yes, precisely those that I've seen listed for a while but are still unfilled, I've seen more than a few recently.

I admire that, you would almost become a consultancy which is the way forward really for contracting. Good luck. Let us know how you get on.

[data001]

Are you referring to roles you have seen advertised which haven't been filled for a period of time, so you think you may be able to help out?
If so it's not such a bad idea especially if you can go direct to the end client. If they have a need and a project which has to be done then they may be agreeable.

Yes, precisely those that I've seen listed for a while but are still unfilled, I've seen more than a few recently.

[data001]

There's no harm in asking.
Is this direct with the end client, or via an agency?

Either one, I was asking hypothetically.

[GregRickshaw]

Is it worth doing this? Has anyone tried doing this, any luck?

I see a lot of perm roles offered and I would be interested if they were contract ideally outside IR35.

Are you referring to roles you have seen advertised which haven't been filled for a period of time, so you think you may be able to help out?
If so it's not such a bad idea especially if you can go direct to the end client. If they have a need and a project which has to be done then they may be agreeable.

[WTFH]

I'm asking if it's worth getting them to consider whether they could fill the role quicker by changing the terms.

There's no harm in asking.
Is this direct with the end client, or via an agency?

[Snooky]

How long have you been contracting?
What is your skillset?
Why would a company want to hire you as an outside IR35 contractor for a role they have already effectively declared as being inside?

If they were struggling to fill it on a permie basis, possibly. But then they'd probably be advertising it already as contract/perm