Reply to: Opt-in and Opt-out: Need advice still on my first contract (I won't renew after end)

[BlasterBates]

Where there is no definitive proof the general consensus from the experts is it makes no difference to IR35.

https://www.contractorcalculator.co....n_opt_out.aspx

employment status is determined on a case-by-case basis, a limited company contractor accepting on paper that they are controlled by the client and wish to be covered by the regulations is sending a pretty negative message to HMRC about their employment status. Control by the client is a key factor in determining the employment status of a contractor, and can be part of a package of evidence that puts a contractor inside IR35.

[northernladuk]

By making a point of opting in means the agency has to satisfy the regulations which may push your contract within IR35. .

Where there is no definitive proof the general consensus from the experts is it makes no difference to IR35.

[BlasterBates]

By making a point of opting in means the agency has to satisfy the regulations which may push your contract within IR35. There is nothing important you get from the regulations which you can't get without it. As London Manc says you can ask for weekly payments. Some contractors think they're covered by the regulations because they haven't specifically opted out, but it's more complicated than that as anyone not under direct control of the client is automatically not covered, i.e. for it to be worth it everything in the regulations should be written into your "temporary employment" contract. Personally I wouldn't want a contract that reads like a temporary employment contract.

[SueEllen]

The opt in / opt out debate - oh how I’ve missed you

I haven't.

[Andy Hallett]

The opt in / opt out debate - oh how I’ve missed you

[northernladuk]

An experienced contractor I worked with said he opted out as it implies financial risk, therefore another argument against being caught IR35.

Make of that what you will, I'm waiting for my curry to cool down.

qh

Didn't you manage to stifle a laugh when they said it?

[MrMarkyMark]

Does the client contacting you directly, offering the gig to you then putting you in touch with their agency count as an introduction? I opted out for ease and for it being worth the sheet of paper it was printed on.

I spent all that time explaining it all to them the last time around as well.

That effort had the desired effect before, but I just didn't have the fight in me this time around

[quackhandle]

An experienced contractor I worked with said he opted out as it implies financial risk, therefore another argument against being caught IR35.

Make of that what you will, I'm waiting for my curry to cool down.

qh

[LondonManc]

Best advice is to ignore it anyway. The chances are very high that the agency hasn't met the criteria necessary to allow you to opt out so you'll be in anyway. If the "opting out" form has arrived with the contract after being accepted for the gig it's already too late so sign it and ignore it.

One risk is that - thanks to a ruling by the relevant Department - companies are free to choose who to trade with and under what conditions. Make a fuss and the gig will mysteriously disappear.

(BTW you can't opt in. You're in unless you correctly opt out before introduction to the client. Snag is, nobody has defined "introduction" and naturally we have a different view to the agencies about when this has occurred.)

Does the client contacting you directly, offering the gig to you then putting you in touch with their agency count as an introduction? I opted out for ease and for it being worth the sheet of paper it was printed on.

[malvolio]

Hi Stek,

Do you mean you have opted-in every time? This is one of the larger agencies as well.

Best advice is to ignore it anyway. The chances are very high that the agency hasn't met the criteria necessary to allow you to opt out so you'll be in anyway. If the "opting out" form has arrived with the contract after being accepted for the gig it's already too late so sign it and ignore it.

One risk is that - thanks to a ruling by the relevant Department - companies are free to choose who to trade with and under what conditions. Make a fuss and the gig will mysteriously disappear.

(BTW you can't opt in. You're in unless you correctly opt out before introduction to the client. Snag is, nobody has defined "introduction" and naturally we have a different view to the agencies about when this has occurred.)

[stek]

Hi Stek,

Do you mean you have opted-in every time? This is one of the larger agencies as well.

I opted-out everytime, mostly because I wasn't even aware of it (before I joined CUK and started worrying about everything) and because I found it onerous to comply as they don't want you to opt-in, and lately cos I've been working abroad and have gone brolly/local payroll for an easy life.

[ChrisHadfield]

If you try and opt-in they'll make it so hard and onerous you'll cave in. I have everytime and to be honest I've never suffered. But then again I've never worked via anyone other than the big agencies that have been around for ages.

Hi Stek,

Do you mean you have opted-in every time? This is one of the larger agencies as well.

[stek]

If you try and opt-in they'll make it so hard and onerous you'll cave in. I have everytime and to be honest I've never suffered. But then again I've never worked via anyone other than the big agencies that have been around for ages.

[ChrisHadfield]

I have already met the 'director' in a previous interview meeting so not sure if that counts.

The agency has a 5 month waiting clause before contacting the client directly.

[northernladyuk]

Depends.

... on whether you want to be paid if the end-client decides they don't want to pay the agency