Reply to: State of the Market

[oliverson]

Honestly fella ... for months this has been the same cycle. Are you actually looking for work or not

Yes I am and I've had no offers prior to these two in several months, so how can this be 'the same cycle'?

So, irrespective of whoever did the SDS (still yet to see one), the client has provided assurance that the role has been determined as outside IR35 by a dedicated external legal time. So, in my mind, whether it's wrong or right, that gets me off the hook. There's nothing in the contract that would expose me to any liability if the assessment was wrong, so I've just accepted the contract.

As for offer 2, and the agent's ignorance, if that comes off as well, 'in some shape or form', then IR35 probably isn't an issue, in the sense of IR35 'reforms', because the client definitely falls within the definition of a small company per the Companies Act 2006 (until my friend the most wonderful Reeves abolishes that in tomorrow's budget - you never know).

My post was largely about the confusion surrounding IR35 and how little the 'engager' or recruitment people really do know on the subject.

[sadkingbilly]

Maybe you are being too precious

yep.

[fatJock]

Work is never work until it's over the line, as I am now finding.

Honestly fella ... for months this has been the same cycle. Are you actually looking for work or not

[Dorkeaux]

Work is never work until it's over the line, as I am now finding.

'Offer 1' - consultancy client when asked for SDS is reporting that their client has provided one! Contract assessment has also failed IR35. Several contractors are already on site.

'Offer 2' - agent has no idea what IR35 is. Seriously.

So, JobServe it is then!

Sorry to hear it. You force me to formally rescind the banana.

Not sure I understand the problems.

For 1), the final client is responsible for providing the SDS. Which they have. What's the problem there?

What do you mean by "failed IR35" exactly? Did you personally run it through the CEST tool, or do you mean something else?

Being IR35 compliant goes role by role, rather than by client or contractor. If the consultancy has other people on the client site outside IR35, then that means the client doesn't have a blanket Inside policy. Which is good.
There might be a way to better define the role and the SOW to be IR35 compliant.

For 2) I don't understand why that is an automatic pass on the role they are offering.
I had to deal with a similar agent, just educate them. This guy in question had a great role, but I had to hold his little hand throughout the process. Then never had to speak to him again.


Maybe you are being too precious. It's always a risk, there are no bulletproof SDS, SOW nor outside IR35 contracts thanks to the way HMRC has been arranged and funded. Just "guidelines" that can be changed or interpreted any way HMRC likes. You just have to try not to raise any red flags and make it as low-risk as possible.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

So, hot off a banning for calling Reeves ‘Rachel from accounts’, deemed as ‘sexism’. Let’s leave it right there shall we?

You mean you are determined to repeat the thing you got banned for? Why? Are you saying it's just a nasty unimaginative and uncalled for personal insult, but not in any way motivated by sexism?

[oliverson]

I am glad a couple of people have found work. I guess the challenge is finding the contract after this in good time and not have another run of several months on the bench.

Still, a problem for another time and quite interesting that there seems to be some life in the traditionally quiet run up to Christmas which hopefully bodes well for the New Year.

Work is never work until it's over the line, as I am now finding.

'Offer 1' - consultancy client when asked for SDS is reporting that their client has provided one! Contract assessment has also failed IR35. Several contractors are already on site.

'Offer 2' - agent has no idea what IR35 is. Seriously.

So, JobServe it is then!

[SussexSeagull]

I am glad a couple of people have found work. I guess the challenge is finding the contract after this in good time and not have another run of several months on the bench.

Still, a problem for another time and quite interesting that there seems to be some life in the traditionally quiet run up to Christmas which hopefully bodes well for the New Year.

[rocktronAMP]

So, hot off a banning for calling Reeves ‘Rachel from accounts’, deemed as ‘sexism’. Let’s leave it right there shall we?

Sad to decline the other offer but whilst a higher rate and a more fulfilling project, the duration was short. Again outside IR35 and totally remote except an odd visit to the office once a month or so. On receiving my rejection the client was gutted so I’m told. Feel kind of bad on that but perhaps we can work something out later on. There may be an outside chance of servicing both contracts.

just goes to show that dogged determination pays off in the end and the phrase ‘ when you’re going through hell, keep going’ rings very true.

keep believing people!

Congratulations! You were getting "rattie" man over the past weeks, but I understand. We all understand your pain: gig search, uncertainty and feeling very undervalued.

On the Friday 14th November 2025 a week ahead of you, I accepted a verbal contract offer and then official email , but I kept it quiet, until today (well Friday 21st November). I received the DocuSign PDF and I signed from my side.

Like you I am disappointed in my new contract rate, but hey it is 10 - 12 month contract, which in this dire market I will take. I am losing £75 per day compared to earlier rate gig, so something like £15,000 per year (220 * £75), but hey it is an Outside IR35 too! On the same day of the verbal offer, suddenly I had interview requests for a well-paid Inside IR35 dev job a day north of £700 per day and I had asked the agency / consultancy if I could choose my umbrella, they said yes, I'd gone with Lucy's Clarity. However, I'd already crossed the line. Two trains came into the depot. Sod's law and all.

I am still mistrustful of all of this contracting malarkey. I won't trust any consultancy any more TBH, the Statements of Work (SoW) are volatile and who knows with budget this week, Wednesday. In my contract, I have the 30 days payment terms: payment after when timesheet is submitted and invoice against project time validated. I will keep my job search half-open. So I will not be truly satisfied until the something like 30th January 2026(!), because I will have entered my December timesheet / invoice on 23rd December or Xmas Eve. I have learnt wisdom alot from others here on this forum. Thank yous YANCOTBAC (sure maybe!?!)

[SchumiStars]

That graph does not look right. This is the worst I have seen it. I have been working since 1999 and contracting since 2008.

I have been thinking, saying, looking at getting a government grant to learn how to become a teacher. The wife has been studying for another degree at Oxford for a couple of years so may join her.

[SussexSeagull]

Interesting point. Are there fewer people in their early to mid-30s, continuing to go into contracting?

10-15 years ago it seemed that I worked with a lot of contractors who were under 35. Now there seem to be fewer younger ones about.

This forum seems to be disproportionately populated by people well past 40 so I don't think we're particularly representative of 'the market'.

I suspect what happens is you become older than the person interviewing you and the perception is you are more stuck in your ways than younger candidates.

Certainly in what I did the focus went from doing decent Test Analysis that could then potentially lead to automated testing to having a CV full of testing frameworks.

Not my field but developers seem to need to have an increasing range of development platforms non their CV which I suspect most of them could learn in their sleep because they are experienced developers. This lends itself to younger coders who have the time to chase the next trend in their spare time and not have families to worry about.

Some would call it ageism. I call it sidelining a lot of valuable experience that has a track record of delivery.

[SussexSeagull]

Covid year, 2020, aside. The vast majority of contractors had it good between 2011 and 2022.

There may have been a very small minority that struggled between 2011 and 2022, but that was probably down to them (out of date skillset) but not due to the state of the market.

It has only been since mid 2022 that large numbers of contractors have been struggling to find anything at all.

Broadly agree with that. I had a bit of time out after the crash in 2008 and post Brexit I had a year out, although in hindsight that was probably largely due to having a two and a half year contract that didn’t offer any sellable skills before that. Once the market adjusted during COVID I did ok.

The problem for me was the gaps between contracts went from 2-4 weeks to get the paperwork sorted out and put your feet up to several months. Plus I found the quality of work went downhill.

is only one person’s experience though.

[SussexSeagull]

So, hot off a banning for calling Reeves ‘Rachel from accounts’, deemed as ‘sexism’. Let’s leave it right there shall we?

in my banned time I have some good news in the form of two offers, one of which I accepted and start Monday possibly. Possibly 2-3 years of work on this project I’m told. Outside IR35 and totally remote. Not the biggest rate I’ve had but the value of the project over time is significant.

Sad to decline the other offer but whilst a higher rate and a more fulfilling project, the duration was short. Again outside IR35 and totally remote except an odd visit to the office once a month or so. On receiving my rejection the client was gutted so I’m told. Feel kind of bad on that but perhaps we can work something out later on. There may be an outside chance of servicing both contracts.

just goes to show that dogged determination pays off in the end and the phrase ‘ when you’re going through hell, keep going’ rings very true.

keep believing people!

Well done. Odd how two come along at once.

[avonleigh]

Covid year, 2020, aside. The vast majority of contractors had it good between 2011 and 2022.

There may have been a very small minority that struggled between 2011 and 2022, but that was probably down to them (out of date skillset) but not due to the state of the market.

It has only been since mid 2022 that large numbers of contractors have been struggling to find anything at all.

Totally agree on this. The market has only been in decline since 2022.

And big congrats to Oliverson.

[sadkingbilly]

there have been boom times and lean times since 1972 in contracting.
it didn't start in 199x or whenever webdevs were conceived.
contracting's about surviving the vagaries.
or, unfortunately, in a lot of cases, whining continually about the unfairness of life, the universe, and everything.

[Fraidycat]

Covid year, 2020, aside. The vast majority of contractors had it good between 2011 and 2022.

There may have been a very small minority that struggled between 2011 and 2022, but that was probably down to them (out of date skillset) but not due to the state of the market.

It has only been since mid 2022 that large numbers of contractors have been struggling to find anything at all.