• Visitors can check out the Forum FAQ by clicking this link. You have to register before you can post: click the REGISTER link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. View our Forum Privacy Policy.
  • Want to receive the latest contracting news and advice straight to your inbox? Sign up to the ContractorUK newsletter here. Every sign up will also be entered into a draw to WIN £100 Amazon vouchers!
Collapse

You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:

  • You are not logged in. If you are already registered, fill in the form below to log in, or follow the "Sign Up" link to register a new account.
  • You may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
  • If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.

Previously on "State of the Market"

Collapse

  • sreed
    replied
    I've never used Jobserve much but having periodically glanced at it (for FS PM roles) after hearing it come up on the forum, it definitely looks like there's been a noticeable uptick in FS PM roles compared to when I checked a few times last year. A lot of it is 2 days/week hybrid London and the money is decent.

    Leave a comment:


  • northernladuk
    replied
    Originally posted by willendure View Post

    I have only ever worked as an outside IR35 contractor, my entire career starting in 2001. I did once or twice apply for permie roles, but always the question "I see you've only every been a contractor, are you just applying for a permie role because the market it dead just now?". The only permie roles I have been offered was when working as a contractor somewhere and they asked if I wanted to go perm, on about 1/2 of the money!
    Which is a perfect valid question. We've got a new post on here just this morning from someone that went perm in the bad times and is now looking to go back contracting. The percentage of people that were contract, went perm and have gone contracting again must be massive so can't blame the employers for being wary.

    We've also got a number of very experienced contractors in cushy perm roles after being asked to go perm by their client. They last two gigs I've worked in the client managers were ex-contractors lured in by a decent offer during hard times. Both are quite happy with the situation due to life changes. Some clients will take the mick with an awful rate but there are plenty of gigs where the contractor holds a lot of sway with the package and can get a very good deal they couldn't in the market.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fraidycat
    replied
    FTSE 250 making new 52 week high today, over 19,800.

    We need to see it close above 21,000 this year to confirm the uptrend.

    A summer sell off is expected in the next six months, so that could ruin things..
    Last edited by Fraidycat; Today, 10:34.

    Leave a comment:


  • willendure
    replied
    Originally posted by hungry_hog View Post
    Never understand how people are able to jump back in and out like sentry duty.
    I have only ever worked as an outside IR35 contractor, my entire career starting in 2001. I did once or twice apply for permie roles, but always the question "I see you've only every been a contractor, are you just applying for a permie role because the market it dead just now?". The only permie roles I have been offered was when working as a contractor somewhere and they asked if I wanted to go perm, on about 1/2 of the money!

    Leave a comment:


  • quackhandle
    replied
    Originally posted by oliverson View Post
    This thread is taking a disturbing turn down the 'job' (perm) side!
    “The Dark Side is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural.”

    qh

    Leave a comment:


  • hungry_hog
    replied
    I find when I go for perm interviews (and it doesn't happen often) I have no credibility as a 15 year contractor. Whereas contract interviews pretty much 1 in 2 chance I will get it.
    And then if you do get back in you have a 3 months notice.

    Never understand how people are able to jump back in and out like sentry duty.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fraidycat
    replied
    Originally posted by oliverson View Post
    This thread is taking a disturbing turn down the 'job' (perm) side!
    Begging bowls out until the market picks up, then leg it back into contract

    Leave a comment:


  • tsmith
    replied
    Originally posted by willendure View Post
    Finally got through to the recruitment consultant I have been chasing since friday. Took at least 6 phone calls to finally make contact with a human being. And did not answer any of my emails. Apparently he already has 300 CVs from TOGAF Certified Architects. He also told me I was rude, I probably came accross as being a little abrupt due to having to be so pushy to get a phone call through. So that didn't really go very well, already has his short list before hes even looked at my CV, which was a very strong match to the job. I guess everyone just slaps all the keywords in their CV including TOGAF, whether they have them or not.

    What a tulip market.

    I need a plan B. Open a coffee shop or something.
    Yea man Ive been on a side hustle for 2 years luckily and applying for stuff for the rest of the time. Maybe without the side hustle Id have been applying for a few more roles -seems like you have to be calling people these days. Just digital comms doesnt cut it.

    Most side hustles arent as easy as the Youtube course shillers pretend and will take significant grind to get to salary replacement levels is the problem

    Now its looking increasingly like I will have to go deeper into the side hustle and abandon IT altogether though. Luckily I have skill outside of IT but it wont be straightforward and will probably mean being self employed forever with what Ive got planned

    Leave a comment:


  • sreed
    replied
    Originally posted by dsc View Post
    LI jobs seems full with perm jobs in my industry, but pay is on 2015 levels and 95% are hybrid which is probably the most annoying tulipe ever.
    I wouldn’t discount roles advertised as ‘hybrid’. From experience, in some cases all it means is that you will need to drop in to the office once in a while and/or that they don’t want to be flooded with applications from across the country or overseas! An initial conversation can usually clear this up.

    I’ve had the other extreme as well where a hybrid role turned out to be a 4 days/week presence in Liverpool but the recruiter advertised it as hybrid as he wasn’t getting enough applications when the ad said on-site.

    My current contract was advertised as hybrid far-off-northern-city but to all intents and purposes it’s a remote role with occasional visits to the office. I’ve only had to visit twice in 5 months.

    Leave a comment:


  • oliverson
    replied
    This thread is taking a disturbing turn down the 'job' (perm) side!

    Leave a comment:


  • Fraidycat
    replied
    Originally posted by dsc View Post
    Yup, seen that as well, on a lot I see 3yrs+ which makes me thing if you have over 10yrs, it's a quick rejection.
    Its so they can pay 'mid level' salaries. They will more than happily take someone with 10yrs+ who is prepared to work for mid level pay. By mid level pay i mean in the 45K to 70K range.
    Last edited by Fraidycat; Yesterday, 17:41.

    Leave a comment:


  • dsc
    replied
    Originally posted by tsmith View Post
    [...]Oh asking salary is defacto standard now almost. And most roles seem to be 3 to 5 years experience. How can everything be 3 to 5 years?
    [...]
    Yup, seen that as well, on a lot I see 3yrs+ which makes me thing if you have over 10yrs, it's a quick rejection. Same with the salary question, they basically probe the market at the lowest amount, if they get someone reasonable, who ticks 50% of the requirements, they probably look at the value vs cost ratio, assume some skills can be thought and reject anyone else. It's only when the position is so niche, or they really know who they really want, they might actually not bin you for putting 50k+ on the expected salary.

    Originally posted by edison
    In my niche, current advertised salaries seem all over the place. I'm seeing some at around the same package or slightly lower than I was on as a perm between 2008 and 2011. Quite a few are significantly lower.

    The perm application process is such a faff. Started doing an application for a well known travel company and it asks for salary but you can only put in a single number, not a range. There's not that much detail in the advert so I can't fully gauge the scope and level of responsibilities, so how can I put in a single figure? It just seems a way to force people to lower their expectations to get past what is probably a candidate knockout question.
    I also love the fact that often they ask what is you salary expectation (bonus included) when you don't even bloody know what the work is, what is possible in terms of bonus etc. Tell me what you can pay for what skills and then we can negotiate and stop wasting people's time ffs

    Btw I'm fairly sure most job offers just get recycled on LI, I've signed up to a few job alerts and at the start it said 200-500+ job offers across Europe, but now daily I get maybe 2/3 new ones per day, so yeah

    Leave a comment:


  • edison
    replied
    Originally posted by dsc View Post
    LI jobs seems full with perm jobs in my industry, but pay is on 2015 levels and 95% are hybrid which is probably the most annoying tulipe ever. It does absolutely nothing to increase the amount of people applying, as anyone further than driveable distance from the office will pass anyway. EU jobs (got an EU passport) are similar, the ones I applied to straight away ask if you are ok relocating as you have to be local and of course it's all hybrid. On top of this they ask for your expected salary range and there's no salary brackets shown anywhere on the job spec. Oh and everything takes absolute effin ages...

    How I missed perm
    In my niche, current advertised salaries seem all over the place. I'm seeing some at around the same package or slightly lower than I was on as a perm between 2008 and 2011. Quite a few are significantly lower.

    The perm application process is such a faff. Started doing an application for a well known travel company and it asks for salary but you can only put in a single number, not a range. There's not that much detail in the advert so I can't fully gauge the scope and level of responsibilities, so how can I put in a single figure? It just seems a way to force people to lower their expectations to get past what is probably a candidate knockout question.

    Leave a comment:


  • edison
    replied
    Originally posted by CoolCat View Post

    yes all of that is true.

    best indication of whether a large project or programme will be a success, is whether enough of the senior people on it have regularly produced success in the past. not methodology, not BS on slides, or any of the rest of it.

    the only real genuine transformation stuff now is mergers & acquisitions where there is real business imperative to do things to join together, improve, change, & sometimes separate out different businesses. sometimes you get something similar when a big org wants to setup a brand new division. the number of interviews I have been to where the interviewing side are convinced they are going to bring about great change by simply using a slightly different methodology is high, often they have not got the 1st idea what they are doing, it can be hard not to just openly laugh at them, but these people exist, and in the land of the blind the one eyed giant is king.
    Hardly any 'transformation' programmes are transformative in any true sense of the word. True transformation is about developing significant new business capabilities, being able to bring new products and services to market quicker, increasing innovation, entering new markets etc.

    Most of what companies called transformation is really digitisation of old legacy systems and processes or technology refreshes.

    I worked on one so called transformation programme for two years that was estimated to take 3 years. Ended up taking over 6 years and by the time it was finished, the company was really only on at a level with their competitors from years before. And had spent twice as much as forecasted.

    Leave a comment:


  • willendure
    replied
    Finally got through to the recruitment consultant I have been chasing since friday. Took at least 6 phone calls to finally make contact with a human being. And did not answer any of my emails. Apparently he already has 300 CVs from TOGAF Certified Architects. He also told me I was rude, I probably came accross as being a little abrupt due to having to be so pushy to get a phone call through. So that didn't really go very well, already has his short list before hes even looked at my CV, which was a very strong match to the job. I guess everyone just slaps all the keywords in their CV including TOGAF, whether they have them or not.

    What a tulip market.

    I need a plan B. Open a coffee shop or something.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X