Reply to: FAO PM's - do you give a crap if a non-PM has or doesn't have PRINCE2?

[Glencky]

I'm now contracting as a project and programme manager. Before this I spent 12 years in a permie career with the last 8 or so as a programme manager, recruiting contract PMs, BAs and PMO/PSOs (as well as permies). I have never once actively looked for any kind of professional PM qualification *for a PM*, let alone for any non-PM! All I'm ever interested in is their professional experience.

That said, I am my self a PMP (Project Management Professional, the equivalent US/ international qualification to PRINCE2 - although they're not exactly 'equivalents' I guess... anyway...) and I would count it as a 'mental tick in the box' if I did see a CV with either or both qualifications. The PMI qualification is quite a bit harder to get than PRINCE 2, and my previous organisation paid for the training when I was a permie. It's also reasonably hard to maintain in that you need a fair amount of continuing professional development (over and above 'doing your day job') to maintain it. Yet since I became a contractor I have put in the time and effort to maintain the qualification because ultimately I'm selling myself, and I think it makes me a bit more marketable.

I agree with the comments so far about agents - it's the agents who I think you need to 'get past' often, and I think it's the agents who are more likely to look for qualifications as evidence of the calibre of a candidate - remember they don't work in the field and usually have never worked in the field so they have to judge somehow.

I have more friends who don't work anywhere near projects who have PRINCE2 qualifications than I know PMs who have them! So I think it's worth getting as it seems to be generally valued by employers at the moment, and as others have said it's not that costly in terms of either time or money. But at best it's likely to be a tool to help you get to interview. At worst, it'll be ignored.

The exception, as others have said, is public sector where my understanding is it's always going to be mandatory.

[leovzla]

Would you like to watch a Video which describes briefly PRINCE2 , Process and principles? You can watch this video which is I think very useful.

Also if you would like to have some PRINCE2 sample exam or free training manual you can use this.

And I think you can find the cheapest PRICE2 exam here

I hope this help you!

[SunnyInHades]

'ere's all you need. Fortunes in time and money spent (wasted?) teaching/discussing/testing this

PRINCE2 For Dummies (UK Edition) Cheat Sheet
PRINCE2 is an essential project management method, helping users organise, manage and direct their projects to time and within budget.

Project Start-Up with PRINCE2
At the start-up point in the PRINCE2 project management method, you’re simply getting together enough information to check if the project is worth planning in detail and to provide key information for planning.
Key: Do this really fast.
Decision at the end: Shall we go on to full planning (initiation)?
Put key roles in place (minimum is Project Executive and Project Manager)
Produce the Project Brief (sketch of the project idea)
Make sure the Business Case looks viable – but only in outline
Make sure that the risks look acceptable – but, again, only in outline
Plan the Initiation Stage, allowing for risk analysis and the Business Case

Project Planning with PRINCE2
Time spent properly planning is seldom wasted, but huge amounts of project time can be wasted from inadequate plans that aren’t thought through. Take the rights steps at the project initiation stage to ensure your PRINCE2 project turns out right.
Key: Balance the amount of planning against the need for control.
Decision at the end: Do we really want to commit to run this project?
Decide on the appropriate level of quality
Produce Product and Activity plans for the project
Product Product and Activity plans for the first stage after initiation
Perform a full risk analysis
Produce a full Business Case
Put simple controls and reporting procedures in place
Assemble the Project Initiation Document (PID)

Project Stages in PRINCE2 Project Management
The products make superb milestones, and PRINCE2 projects, like any others, are about delivery, not about being busy. Make quite sure that products are to the specified quality.
Key: Check progress with the Product Checklist and also quality.
Decision throughout: Is everything on track or is there an exception?
Give work out to teams and monitor each team’s progress
Report progress regularly to the Project Board using the Highlight Report
Monitor the progress of the stage at set intervals
Adjust the running of the stage to ensure completion within set limits
Immediately report any exceptions to the Project Board if limits cannot be met
Look at any inbound Project Issues (problems and so on) and decide action

Exception Plans with PRINCE2 Project Management
Exceptions in PRINCE2 projects, as in all projects need rapid but careful investigation. For example, there’s a big difference between overspending in a stage and early spending. PRINCE2 provides the method for dealing with exceptional circumstances.
Key: Find the underlying reasons, not just the superficial cause.
Decision at the end: Carry on (perhaps on a new plan) or stop the project?
Investigate rapidly and think through options
Report to the Project Board and get a decision on the way forward
Re-plan the rest of the stage if needed
Get approval to continue on the basis of the new plan

End Stage in PRINCE2 Project Management
In PRINCE2 projects, End Stage work is done by the Project Manager towards the end of the stage, followed by the Project Board’s meeting to decide whether or not to continue.
Key: Keep things as simple as you can. Don’t write huge reports.
Decision at the end: Authorise the next stage, or stop the project?
Check that the current stage work is complete, or almost complete
Plan the next stage, updating the Project Plan as necessary
Update the Business Case and Risk Log to reflect the latest information
Produce a report on the current stage for the Project Board
Hold the End Stage meeting of the Project Board (End Stage Assessment)

PRINCE2 Project Management Project Closure
The work at this point in a PRINCE2 project is done by the Project Manager towards the end of the last stage to prepare for the Project Board meeting which confirms closure.
Key: Double-check everything’s done, including any final testing.
Decision at the end: Is everything done and can you close the project?
Check everything is complete or, in the case of premature close, that as much as possible has been salvaged from the project to minimise wastage
Consider work needed in the organisation after the project (Follow-on Actions) including Post Project Review to measure benefits delivery
Report on the project, giving final cost, time, and quality information and commenting on the achievement of objectives
Consider and pass on the lessons learned (good and bad) from this project

[Peter Loew]

I wonder how much longer PRINCE2 can actually survive without becoming completely irrelevant. People usually associate PRINCE2 with Waterfall when it comes to software based projects.

More so though, I think PRINCE2 shows that you have an understanding of what a formal project delivery structure can look like and that for me where it is most valuable.

[Project Monkey]

Just an idle thought, really. I like to be constructive in my bench time, and last year that saw me finishing off the entire exam track for my main specialism. I focus solely on doing project based work, so I'm after opinions on whether PRINCE2 would help me get in the door at all?

For the avoidance of doubt - I have no particular interest in Project Management as a thing (Apart from being better at my own job, of course), and I certainly can't see myself ever becoming a project manager but like I say, I'm always working WITH Project Managers and due to what I do I'm normally reporting directly to a senior PM, if not the Programme Manager

No.

[northernladuk]

If it helps you get off the bench 2 days earlier at anytime in the next 5 years or something it's gotta be a no brainer at £695 for the course surely?

[vwdan]

Thanks folks, interesting thoughts and comments!

[redgiant]

I am a PM of 10+ years my PRINCE2 is now expired.

PRINCE2 is used widely in Public Sector. A hybrid is used in the private sector, usually an organisation will have a methodology they follow for delivering projects, they will always say it is based on the PRINCE 2 framework (ie RPD @ Thomson Reuters).

As a non PM, I don't see why PRINCE2 would be useful imo, unless you are going for these roles.

And in my opinion when I review CV's of PM's I am looking for project delivery experience mainly, as opposed to certs

+1 and the same goes with the PMI PMP qualification - experience > qualifications for a PM applying for a PM contract role.

However for a non PM who is interested in the overall project lifecycle and would like a qualification to study for then the basic PRINCE2 foundation covers the important points and terminology. The PRINCE2 practitioner just takes the foundation principles and applies it to a case study and is not that useful IMO.

[MercladUK]

I am a PM of 10+ years my PRINCE2 is now expired.

PRINCE2 is used widely in Public Sector. A hybrid is used in the private sector, usually an organisation will have a methodology they follow for delivering projects, they will always say it is based on the PRINCE 2 framework (ie RPD @ Thomson Reuters).

As a non PM, I don't see why PRINCE2 would be useful imo, unless you are going for these roles.

And in my opinion when I review CV's of PM's I am looking for project delivery experience mainly, as opposed to certs

[Liamxtype]

I've got it, and I don't even give a crap whether I've got it or not. I've not met anyone who really uses PRINCE. Yes yes, the lessons tell you you must use all of it, and that if you pick and choose then it's a 'PINO' (Prince in name only!) and therefore bad. But the reality is that you have to pick an choose the useful parts (which are really just formalised common sense) or otherwise you'd never get anything done.

Mind you I tend to steer clear of most methodology if I can help it.

+1

[DaveB]

If I'm after a gig that asks for PRINCE in the spec I usually just refer to it lots in the job descriptions in my cv. "Delivered <blah> as part of a project team under PRINCE2" etc. That sort of bollocks. Seems to do the trick.

I do have the foundation certificate but that was a result of a mandatory permie training course 10 years ago. Not used it since.

[Eirikur]

As a PM (holding Prince 2 qualification myself) I don't care what kind of PM qualification anyone has, PM or non PM.
The only people who seem to care are agencies, as it is just another box they can tick when forwarding a CV.

[cojak]

It will certainly get you past an agent that has been told he has to find someone with Prince 2. Could be worth getting just for that.

Oh yes, agents are a different matter.

[TykeMerc]

The project I'm managing has several suppliers, 3 primary PM's (client, me, other main supplier) and upwards of 50 people actively engaged on delivery, I have absolutely no idea if any of those people, including the other PM's or PM's of inter-dependent projects for that matter have any Prince2 training at all.

My Practitioner expired several years ago and no-one has told me to get a new one or not get a role.

Do it if you want a bit of paper and it interests you, I'd be surprised if anyone on a project would ever ask if you're even seen a Prince2 book let alone read a page of it.

True on the Agent front of course, a box you can tick.

[northernladuk]

It will certainly get you past an agent that has been told he has to find someone with Prince 2. Could be worth getting just for that.