How to Find Out What Agency is Charging Client

[malvolio]

The contract I'm currently in is paying ok but not brilliant however it is close to home so I'm prepared to take a bit less for the convenience. After working a weekend I submitted my usual invoice to the agency plus the extra time spent (in hours) rather than my normal day rate.

The next thing I know I have a guy from client accounts asking me why the agency have billed him £40,000 for a months work. Seems they had not read my contract correctly and had billed my hours as days, hence the uplift in cost.

The upshot of this was that he was at my desk with all the paperwork from the agency in full view so I could clearly see what the client was being charged.. As it happens 10-12% which is fine in my book.

So potentially submit a crazy invoice and you might get more info than you bargained for

ROFLMAO. Only backs up my assertion that 80% of agencies are incompetent.

There again, why is the client complaining to you about the agency's behaviour. Not your problem, is it?

[manclarky]

I want to know if the agency is charging a 60% fee as I understand the going rate is 20% to 25%

Being pedantic, there's more than one way to look at the charges.

1. You're being charged 150% fee (150% of £200 = £300)
2. You're receiving 40% of the rate (40% of £500 = £200)

IF ClientCo are paying £500pd and 25% would be considered almost excessive, then you should be on £375pd
If it's 25% on top of day rate = £500, then you should be on £400pd.

Either way, you're getting screwed (royally). Happened to me once and I joined forces with ClientCo PM to get agency to accept a more reasonable 16% on top (after I'd been there 3 months and earned them oodles of bunts already of course).

Not a lot you can do otherwise though - you've signed up for a rate that you were happy with, until you found out some information that changed your mind. Sometimes, ignorance is bliss.

[badger7579]

The contract I'm currently in is paying ok but not brilliant however it is close to home so I'm prepared to take a bit less for the convenience. After working a weekend I submitted my usual invoice to the agency plus the extra time spent (in hours) rather than my normal day rate.

The next thing I know I have a guy from client accounts asking me why the agency have billed him £40,000 for a months work. Seems they had not read my contract correctly and had billed my hours as days, hence the uplift in cost.

The upshot of this was that he was at my desk with all the paperwork from the agency in full view so I could clearly see what the client was being charged.. As it happens 10-12% which is fine in my book.

So potentially submit a crazy invoice and you might get more info than you bargained for

[malvolio]

I don't see why we should be locked in to these agencies for the entire time we work for a client, it's a restraint of trade

The answer to that is blindingly obvious. Go spend 95% of your time for no income tracking down the gigs for yourself and winning the contract in a competitive bidding war. The agencies are running a retail business that's nothing to do with looking after contractors (or clients either, come to that). There's no point in getting all weepy if they are better at it than you are.

And how is guaranteeing you work a restraint of trade anyway?

[d000hg]

Yes, and I wonder why that may be there? Certainly not to protect the contractor....

Shock news! Contract protects the one who wrote it!

Good luck to an agent trying to recover £300pd from a contractor he's only paying £200pd.

If he leaves and goes direct for 3months that's cost the agent nearly £20k. That seems worth chasing over, if the contract supports it... hardly a few quid.

Asking the agent and pushing the issue seems reasonable, especially if you've evidence. Drop hints you doubt the client would be happy if they found out, etc. But be prepared to be dropped if you play hardball.

[Wanderer]

Although a lot on here would say that the charge rate to the client is none of your business, if the client is paying £500pd then they're expecting a £500pd contractor, not a £200pd contractor. If you're confident that your skill level and current work supports a £500pd contractor level, and the client is happy with your work and wants to retain you for an extension, then they may put pressure on the agency themselves to increase your rate.

Absolutely right. Some contractors don't care about how much the client is paying but I always find out, one way or the other. I think clients and contractors should demand that agencies reveal their margins as a condition of doing business so no one is getting ripped off. I know that this makes some agents squeal like a stuck pig but those are my terms of business. I've always said that I don't grudge the agent their fee, but if it's not transparent then it's wide open to abuse and this impacts clients and contractors alike.

If an agent recruits a permie then they get a fixed fee for doing the job. Why shouldn't it be the same for contracts? OK, some contracts are short, some are long. How about the agent takes a margin, up to a capped amount or for the first 6 months. After that, they have made their money and the contractor and client should be free to do as they please.

I don't see why we should be locked in to these agencies for the entire time we work for a client, it's a restraint of trade

[Clare@InTouch]

Yes, and I wonder why that may be there? Certainly not to protect the contractor....



Good luck to an agent trying to recover £300pd from a contractor he's only paying £200pd.

A reasonable client and agent would hopefully come to some agreement so that everybody's happy. The agent might not be happy about not receiving £300pd, but less is better than nothing. Of course, worst case scenario is the client negotiates the agent's share down but the contractor gets nothing more.

I'm not defending the agent's cut or saying it's right or fair - purely that if the clause is there the agent can legal steps to enforce it.

[meridian]

Go careful with this - some contracts contain clauses that specifically prohibit you from discussing your rate with the client.

Yes, and I wonder why that may be there? Certainly not to protect the contractor....

If the agent loses £300 a day they won't be happy and, if there is such a clause, you could end up in Court. I have actually seen this happen too.

Good luck to an agent trying to recover £300pd from a contractor he's only paying £200pd.

A reasonable client and agent would hopefully come to some agreement so that everybody's happy. The agent might not be happy about not receiving £300pd, but less is better than nothing. Of course, worst case scenario is the client negotiates the agent's share down but the contractor gets nothing more.

[Clare@InTouch]

If the client really is being charged £500, then presumably they are prepared to pay that much for your skills.

How well do you get on with the client? If the agency doesn't budge, how comfortable would you be discussing the rates with the client?

Although a lot on here would say that the charge rate to the client is none of your business, if the client is paying £500pd then they're expecting a £500pd contractor, not a £200pd contractor. If you're confident that your skill level and current work supports a £500pd contractor level, and the client is happy with your work and wants to retain you for an extension, then they may put pressure on the agency themselves to increase your rate.

Go careful with this - some contracts contain clauses that specifically prohibit you from discussing your rate with the client. If the agent loses £300 a day they won't be happy and, if there is such a clause, you could end up in Court. I have actually seen this happen too.

[meridian]

If the client really is being charged £500, then presumably they are prepared to pay that much for your skills.

How well do you get on with the client? If the agency doesn't budge, how comfortable would you be discussing the rates with the client?

Although a lot on here would say that the charge rate to the client is none of your business, if the client is paying £500pd then they're expecting a £500pd contractor, not a £200pd contractor. If you're confident that your skill level and current work supports a £500pd contractor level, and the client is happy with your work and wants to retain you for an extension, then they may put pressure on the agency themselves to increase your rate.

[bsnsintel]

I'll Ask The Agent

I think I'll ask the agent. It's not that I would be "eaten up" or anything if I discover that they really are getting 500 and only giving me 200. The market has been quite tough for the past couple of months and 200 was as good as I could get. Agents keep calling me with jobs paying 400 but they never materialise. If the client really is being charged 500 then I'll probably leave as I had been offered a couple of other roles paying 200.

[monobrow]

How long left on contract?
And are you willing to walk?

If less than a month, wait and at renewal ask them outright and if not forthcoming then walk.

If more than a month, tell them you have another offer @ 400 and what can they do to match it?

Also read the threads about agencies and understand in this business you need to be ruthless or you WILL be exploited by agents. You aint a permie anymore, fight like a madman with an axe is stood over you in a urinal

[northernladuk]

The going rate is whatever they can get and if it is twice what you are being paid they won't lose any sleep over it. Also what the agent charges the client isn't any of your business techincally but it would be good information to have when piling in for a renewal.

Being devils advocate I would say it might not be an area you want to be going in to. If you find that this is the case, you argue and they still won't up your rate you are going to get seriously pissed off and may affect your role. It often happens when people find a colleague is on more than them. One day they are happy with rate and with job, next they are livid and can't do the job knowing what they know now. Knowing what other people's rates are and what the agents rate to the client isn't always somewhere you want to go. I can see how you want to know you have got a sniff but becareful it doesn't eat you alive when you find out.

[Fred Bloggs]

Oh dear, the agent tried to prompt you into asking for more money and you didn't take the bait? Oh dear, not quite cut out for this are we? It is quite possible the agency is charging £500 a day for you. Armed with the info you now have you can ask the agency directly.

[bsnsintel]

Could someone please let me know how I can find out how much the agency is charging the client? I know in other posts people say just ask the agency but they may not tell me (or they may not be honest!) I am on a day rate of 200 but it appears there was some mix up with invoices and my umbrella company received an invoice from the agency which was intended for the client - at a day rate of 500! I want to know if the agency is charging a 60% fee as I understand the going rate is 20% to 25%. I know for this particular role they had a lot of difficulty getting someone with the IT skills required and the agency kept asking me if I was happy with the 200 day rate which with hindsight I now realise was a little suspicious.