No IR35 Delay at RBS

[northernladuk]

Waiting to hear what client co. are going to do, but given that they only really thought about it in the last month, still can't get their heads around it, have no real in house expertise; and those determinations they have issued have been hugely flawed, I suspect they will heave a sigh of relief, boot the whole thing into the long grass and wait until next year to repeat the process.

Is that where I think it is or somewhere different now?

[ascender]

Lorien have now confirmed this apparently (to the disappointment of more than a few mates), so well done @WavyDavy, can we change your status to be officially "In The Know"?

[andydd68]

Interesting opinions so far, thank you.

But think for a moment how powerful this group could be if we stuck together...

Ha..exactly..this site is full of unbelievably depressing and negative opinions..opinions that, less face it, may or may not be accurate.....also when/if we come out of the current health scare, the world of employment will be a very different place.

[eek]

Ha..exactly..this site is full of unbelievably depressing and negative opinions..opinions that, less face it, may or may not be accurate.....also when/if we come out of the current health scare, the world of employment will be a very different place.

Notes the bit in bold, and you think we are depressive and negative....

[mondeoman]

Are companies really doing full U turns. It's only been a couple of days. It's taken them 6 months to put this in place so I'm finding the list of U turns on the new site a bit difficult to believe to be honest.

I expect some will but it seems awfully quick for large organisations to have switched back.

Client have said (paraphrasing) "make your own determination for the next year", so they wont be forcing umbrella or agency on anyone, although every contractor has already been given a blanket inside SDS
Agency have said "declare responsibly"

Oh joy.

[northernladuk]

Client have said (paraphrasing) "make your own determination for the next year", so they wont be forcing umbrella or agency on anyone, although every contractor has already been given a blanket inside SDS
Agency have said "declare responsibly"

Oh joy.

Nice and easy then. Sorted. Inside it is.

[mondeoman]

Nice and easy then. Sorted. Inside it is.

My thoughts exactly - or leave...

[northernladuk]

My thoughts exactly - or leave...

Thing that boils my piss is that people like yourself will do the right thing or at least worry about it. The eejits that just stumbled in will claim outside without a thought and, if we are wrong about the risks and the investigations in the future, will be quids in. Rewarded for bringing this whole thing down on us.

[WordIsBond]

No one has been deemed inside or outside IR35 at RBS. There have been no determinations. There is no retrospective risk. If there had been determinations, I would agree with you. But there is no risk, RBS has gone for PSC blanket ban so does not have the issue of people being deemed inside IR35

You are forgetting two things: HMRC's view about PSC bans, and that the banks are tired of being political targets.

HMRC's view is that those who instituted PSC bans did so because that fit the working practices. In other words, in their view everyone at those places should have been inside. Therefore, there is retrospective risk.

Second, for a bank that has (deservedly) received so much bad press and wants to rebuild their reputation, they want to be able to say, "The reforms brought to our attention that there might be some inappropriate tax avoidance going on among those who work with RBS. We don't want to facilitate that, so we won't be working with PSCs anymore." It's a big political win for them even if the 'reform' has been rolled back.

[northernladuk]

You are forgetting two things: HMRC's view about PSC bans, and that the banks are tired of being political targets.

HMRC's view is that those who instituted PSC bans did so because that fit the working practices. In other words, in their view everyone at those places should have been inside. Therefore, there is retrospective risk.

Second, for a bank that has (deservedly) received so much bad press and wants to rebuild their reputation, they want to be able to say, "The reforms brought to our attention that there might be some inappropriate tax avoidance going on among those who work with RBS. We don't want to facilitate that, so we won't be working with PSCs anymore." It's a big political win for them even if the 'reform' has been rolled back.

I agree with both points... Another to add.
There is plenty of evidence that some of the banks just use contracting as a way to recruit, not because they want skills they don't have to come deliver SoW type deliverables. There is no way, if they had done it properly, that everyone would be outside. Just because it was a blanket it does not mean everyone is now by defacto outside now they've done a U Turn. I'd be willing to bet these types of places will have more insides that anywhere else.
The fact that so many people are saying they are outside because the blanket is lifted also shows there are a lot of people in these places that don't know about IR35 almost putting themselves inside as well.

If pressure mounts on them to do it properly next year I think there are going to be a lot of bad surprises for people a hell of a lot of worried contractors next time round and will make up a majority of the posters asking what to do when this hits next time.

The U turn is not necessarily a good thing for many people in blanket roles IMO.