Rishi Sunak confirms IR35 reform is going ahead w/o any major changes

[Paralytic]

HMRC don't need to - it would be up to you to show otherwise...

And I'm sure HMRC can match NI numbers to NI receipts were they to need to.

I'm at a loss as to whether you are trolling or terminal thick... Either way I will add you to my ignore list on the basis that you seem to be unable to think.

Your avoiding the question leads me to believe you've finally realise that the intermediaries report does not and can not show who has moved from outside to inside, but its easier for you to run away than admit it.

Given the difficulty with the above, this might be too much for you to get your head around, but even the NI receipts will not always be a pointer for HMRC to see which contractors have changed their engagement model, if they put a lot into a salary sacrifice pension.

[eek]

Your avoiding the question leads me to believe you've finally realise that the intermediaries report does not and can not show who has moved from outside to inside, but its easier for you to run away than admit it.

Given the difficulty with the above, this might be too much for you to get your head around, but even the NI receipts will not always be a pointer for HMRC to see which contractors have changed their engagement model, if they put a lot into a salary sacrifice pension.

No, you add NI receipts and oh look what does it tell me

2019 - NI number - NI paid £400
2020 - NI number - NI paid £17000

yet the person was being paid by the same agency = same client (as the odds of you changing client while keeping the same agency is probably 1%).

Yes I would say someone was thick here but it's not the person who revealed the existence of the report....

and being 100% accurate I don't even need to do that

2019 - NI payment received once April 2020 (as directors NI is consolidated over the year)
2020 - NI payment received monthly May, June, July... 2020 (as an employee it's paid monthly).

Now you can hunt for any get out you think exists but HMRC have spent 5+ years preparing for this day and are fully prepped for it.

[Paralytic]

No, you add NI receipts and oh look what does it tell me

2019 - NI number - NI paid £400
2020 - NI number - NI paid £17000

yet the person was being paid by the same agency = same client (as the odds of you changing client while keeping the same agency is probably 1%).

Yes I would say someone was thick here but it's not the person who revealed the existence of the report....

and being 100% accurate I don't even need to do that

2019 - NI payment received once April 2020 (as directors NI is consolidated over the year)
2020 - NI payment received monthly May, June, July... 2020 (as an employee it's paid monthly).

Now you can hunt for any get out you think exists but HMRC have spent 5+ years preparing for this day and are fully prepped for it.

Again: How does that indicate someone has moved from outside to insider, which was the statement i refuted?

PS. you should probably send a note to the admins telling them the ignore button is not working

[dsc]

Again: How does that indicate someone has moved from outside to insider, which was the statement i refuted?

They don't need to know exactly what happened, all they need is to see is a change, which will most likely trigger them to send you a letter. They will then claim you owe them tax and it's your job to prove them wrong. The whole idea of not switching from outside to inside / PAYE / umbrella is to avoid the risk of receiving that letter, if you don't think there is a risk and that HMRC would act reasonable, then carry on regardless.

[LondonManc]

According to the FT its a major success for the industry

Rishi Sunak bows to pressure on IR35 tax changes

Ah, so they'll use lube and give you a cuddle afterwards?

[Paralytic]

They don't need to know exactly what happened, all they need is to see is a change, which will most likely trigger them to send you a letter. They will then claim you owe them tax and it's your job to prove them wrong. The whole idea of not switching from outside to inside / PAYE / umbrella is to avoid the risk of receiving that letter, if you don't think there is a risk and that HMRC would act reasonable, then carry on regardless.

Thanks, you've confirmed what i said - they won't know if someone has moved from outside to inside. That's the point i was making but eek seemed determined to argue a against point I was not making.

[eek]

They don't need to know exactly what happened, all they need is to see is a change, which will most likely trigger them to send you a letter. They will then claim you owe them tax and it's your job to prove them wrong. The whole idea of not switching from outside to inside / PAYE / umbrella is to avoid the risk of receiving that letter, if you don't think there is a risk and that HMRC would act reasonable, then carry on regardless.

Yep, whether it's a blanket ban (no determination) or inside IR35 to HMRC you will look exactly the same (someone who incorrectly determined themselves outside so now worthy of investigation).

[openstrike]

I never understood the contractors earning £700 a day and if they didn't get paid 1 week they "apparently" had no money to pay their bills.

You're really going to enjoy reading about the notorious Sayara Beg.

[abz2020]

No, you add NI receipts and oh look what does it tell me

2019 - NI number - NI paid £400
2020 - NI number - NI paid £17000

yet the person was being paid by the same agency = same client (as the odds of you changing client while keeping the same agency is probably 1%).

Yes I would say someone was thick here but it's not the person who revealed the existence of the report....

and being 100% accurate I don't even need to do that

2019 - NI payment received once April 2020 (as directors NI is consolidated over the year)
2020 - NI payment received monthly May, June, July... 2020 (as an employee it's paid monthly).

Now you can hunt for any get out you think exists but HMRC have spent 5+ years preparing for this day and are fully prepped for it.

Eek,

I am also inclined to think that self determined outside > PSC ban > umbrella might lead to letter from HMRC. And the pain of proving you were out prior April 2020 at FTT.

Some points here:

If it is NIN they are looking at, this situation is common:

2019 - NI number - NI paid £0 on your own LTD's payroll (assumes your are your LTDs employee on employment contract on £8000/yr)
2020 - NI number - NI paid £17000 on umbrella payroll.

I know HMRC can find out more about payments made from intermediary to my LTD, for sure, but not sure how will this generate the pointer you mention above. Or is it worth chasing for them.

[dsc]

Thanks, you've confirmed what i said - they won't know if someone has moved from outside to inside. That's the point i was making but eek seemed determined to argue a against point I was not making.

I haven't confirmed that they won't know, I said that they don't need to know (as a government body they probably have access to way more than you think). It's all about flagging yourself up to the HMRC who has a history of investigating people even if they are doing nothing wrong. Why would you want to attract attention?

In the recent Glaxo case they just sent out letters to tulip ton of people, do you really think they had evidence and cases made against every single person? Of course not, they just went all "assume wrongdoing ask questions later" in like they normally do and it's up to you to prove them wrong.