IR35 PS - So anyone had the discussion yet?

[LondonManc]

PC has gone very quiet. I wonder if he is busy handing over.... or the phones have gone mad and he's just too busy.

Head. Back. In. Sand.

[MrMarkyMark]

Head. Back. In. Sand.

With HMRC forming a fairly civilised queue behind him

[breaktwister]

I can see a lot of agencies going bust over this. When they realise they've now got to pay 12% employer NI out of their cut - which could be less than 12%

My agency told me that they, and a lot of other agencies, do not have their payrolls setup to allow this yet.

[RonBW]

My agency told me that they, and a lot of other agencies, do not have their payrolls setup to allow this yet.

An agency approached me last year (just after the legislation came out) to ask whether their software could handle the calculations, having worked closely on their implementation.

I told them that it could, but they would need the right kind of person to know how to configure it correctly to work.

[NHS1979]

I've made my moves now. Told client that despite offering me several scenarios, I will be leaving current outside-IR35 gig end of March. The next role I take will be post-6th April with a different PSB under an umbrella company and via a different agency.

I have also taken out full QDOS tax liability insurance and (belatedly) full contract and working practices reviews of my assignments for last 3 years.

It doesn't make me immune to anything, but I feel better prepared. The client is miffed but I've said it's nothing personal. The current agency thinks I am 'extreme' for leaving. Other contractors around me seem bemused as they will be staying (one even brought his son in today to do some work, presumably he thinks this is substitution!).

[Andy Hallett]

I've made my moves now. Told client that despite offering me several scenarios, I will be leaving current outside-IR35 gig end of March. The next role I take will be post-6th April with a different PSB under an umbrella company and via a different agency.

I have also taken out full QDOS tax liability insurance and (belatedly) full contract and working practices reviews of my assignments for last 3 years.

It doesn't make me immune to anything, but I feel better prepared. The client is miffed but I've said it's nothing personal. The current agency thinks I am 'extreme' for leaving. Other contractors around me seem bemused as they will be staying (one even brought his son in today to do some work, presumably he thinks this is substitution!).

I can see this being a case study on an HMRC notice board tomorrow morning.

[Whorty]

Interviewed a PS contractor this week for a role at my current private sector client. He works for a well known London based PS dept currently. Asked him why he was looking to leave said PS client, and he quoted IR35. Said following a blanket decision by the client the whole team he works in is looking to leave; they are looking to resign by end of Feb to get paid by 5th April at the latest. Seems the project he is working on is stalling and is dropping into BAU/support role as only perms will be left and there aren't many of them. Chap was well informed

Thankfully he was also very good and I recommended offering him the gig That's one less in the PS for HMRC to chase!

[SeededLoaf]

Are the rules clearer than mud or is it just me?

I was speaking to friend from a previous gig. He's currently deploying a new infrastructure project on behalf of an IT services company to a public body. The chain is as follows:
Him > agency 1 > agency 2 > IT services xyz Ltd > public body

Will he likely be affected? He doesn't think so since he's providing a consultancy to a private Ltd company. His agency has stated that 'we do not anticipate so'. But the question is does it matter how long the chain is if there's a public sector body at the top of it? I think it doesn't look good but he's reluctant to look elsewhere.

I was quoted this from HMRC guidanance on off payroll rules - https://www.gov.uk/government/public...s-do-not-apply

[jamesbrown]

Are the rules clearer than mud or is it just me?

I was speaking to friend from a previous gig. He's currently deploying a new infrastructure project on behalf of an IT services company to a public body. The chain is as follows:
Him > agency 1 > agency 2 > IT services xyz Ltd > public body

Will he likely be affected? He doesn't think so since he's providing a consultancy to a private Ltd company. His agency has stated that 'we do not anticipate so'. But the question is does it matter how long the chain is if there's a public sector body at the top of it? I think it doesn't look good but he's reluctant to look elsewhere.

I was quoted this from HMRC guidanance on off payroll rules - https://www.gov.uk/government/public...s-do-not-apply

The rules are least clear in the situation you describe (private sector supplying the PS). However, they are not completely unclear. It comes down to whether the private company is delivering a public function (fully outsourced) or delivering people. If the supply looks akin to what an agency/body shop would do, the rules apply in the same way they would to an agency, regardless of whether the private company is a "consultancy". Conversely, if the private company is supplying an outsourced service, the rules won't apply. Likewise, in a direct contract, while the rules do apply, the PSC shouldn't be caught if the service is delivered in an outsourced way (in theory ). Bottom line, though, it's for the PS client to make their own determination about whether the rules apply.

[jamesbrown]

does it matter how long the chain is if there's a public sector body at the top of it?

Oh, and on this specific question, no. It's the nature of the supply, not the length of the chain, that matters.

And to preempt the inevitable.... that's what she said