More Farage wisdom

[Mich the Tester]

This will continue until we are inexorably drawn into some European Federal superstate.

Where do you stand on all this?

It won't because the British don't want that, and aside from the British, neither do the Germans, the Dutch and many others. That's where I stand; there will be no European 'federal superstate' if the British and others don't want it; there is also no way for the EU to enforce a superstate. To paraphrase Stalin, how many tank divisions does the EU have?

[Gittins Gal]

It won't because the British don't want that, and aside from the British, neither do the Germans, the Dutch and many others. That's where I stand; there will be no European 'federal superstate' if the British and others don't want it; there is also no way for the EU to enforce a superstate. To paraphrase Stalin, how many tank divisions does the EU have?

It will happen and it is happening.

Not overnight but by a gradual ratcheting process that happens in such a way that nobody really notices.

Until it's too late.

[DodgyAgent]

Nonsense; CMD knows what reforms he wants, Merkel knows what reforms she wants and they are not 100% identical but a basis for negotiation.

What are they and what are they doing about them?

[DodgyAgent]

It won't because the British don't want that, and aside from the British, neither do the Germans, the Dutch and many others. That's where I stand; there will be no European 'federal superstate' if the British and others don't want it; there is also no way for the EU to enforce a superstate. To paraphrase Stalin, how many tank divisions does the EU have?

There is already a European superstate. The most important facet of convergence is with economies. The single currency is a major step in achieving this. Germany does not need tanks. Most of the Euro economies are on their knees and could not buy a tank even if they wanted to.

[Mich the Tester]

It will happen and it is happening.

Not overnight but by a gradual ratcheting process that happens in such a way that nobody really notices.

Until it's too late.

Nobody's noticed, no, except for a majority of UK, Dutch, Danish and German voters who are demanding the return of powers to their respective capital cities. This is tiring; you seem to believe in a conspiracy that may or may not have existed at some stage in the past but which is now well and truly dead. I think part of the trouble is the parochial nature of many British news sources; you don't get to hear what's going on in German politics or Dutch or Danish or Polish politics; perhaps that's fine because it doesn't interest you, but it's important; the whole reason that I say Britain should stay in and join forces with others to renegotiate is that every day I see what's going on on this side of the channel and it frankly amazes me that so many in Britain seem to think that their concerns about the EU are somehow different to those of others in Europe, or that their desire for freedom is somehow unusual. It isn't like that.

[Mich the Tester]

There is already a European superstate. The most important facet of convergence is with economies. The single currency is a major step in achieving this. Germany does not need tanks. Most of the Euro economies are on their knees and could not buy a tank even if they wanted to.

Are you talking about all those countries whose democratically elected governments chose to join the Euro?

[Mich the Tester]

What are they and what are they doing about them?

Well, you might not have noticed that Angela Merkel visited David Cameron last month and they actually started informal negotiations.

[DodgyAgent]

Well, you might not have noticed that Angela Merkel visited David Cameron last month and they actually started informal negotiations.

I will believe it when I see it. In the meantime I will support UKIP in order to keep up the pressure.

[BlasterBates]

for countries like the Netherthelands or Luxembourg who was using the Belgian Franc anyway it made sense to have the Euro, and France and Italy wanted it because they were sick of constant devaluation and inflation and the countries who didn't want it don't have it....so much for being ruled by Brussels.

Truth is the heads of state cut a deal in a smoke filled room and the ones who want an exception get it, because it aint worth arguing about it.

In the end if you want to be in a trading block you have to have some rules, even Switzerland has them.

There is now no passport control at the Swiss border, can you imagine that in the UK.

Leaving the EU won't make a haporth of difference to the UK because they'll still get a massive list of rules to implement from the EU.

...just like Switzerland. oh but the Swiss can refuse....so can David Cameron and the UK gets an opt out, I really see no difference. We're not in the Euro are we and it was a UK decision to let Eastern Europeans in.

Did you know that getting Eastern European countries in the EU was a British project?

[DodgyAgent]

Are you talking about all those countries whose democratically elected governments chose to join the Euro?

Yes and if you are implying that they also therefore voted for the unintended consequences then you are right they did. In their case it is much harder to pull out once they have committed to it. I on the hand think the UK should pull out now unless major reforms are implemented very quickly. Your lot believe we should be staying, sinking deeper and deeper into the federal state of Europe and try to influence reform from within.

Firstly I don't think the establishment consisting of big business and big government have any real intention of getting reform which is why a populist party like UKIP has emerged. If the UK remains in the EU without playing hardball then it will gradually be drawn into the single currency and the rest of the EU agenda.