More underhand tactics by an Indian Firm

[DodgyAgent]

As ever you all seem to think that what you do is more important than it actually is. This pious notion you all seem to have of "quality" is a nonsense. What you are really concerned with is talking yourselves up under the illusion that you somehow deliver "high quality" systems. If I buy a car I am more than happy with a functional skoda. I do not need an Aston martin. If I buy clothes I may get what I pay for but so what?
If lawyers get things wrong then lives and businesses are ruined, same with doctors and accountants. If someone makes a mess of an IT program in a banking system it is the banks responsibility and not the IT person. It is a secondary level function, it is a component of something bigger and as such the risk sits with the ownership of the whole. Law accountancy and health are front line critical services where mistakes cause huge problems.
If IT was so important don't you think that the governments of the world would already have elevated the status of what you do to a fully controlled, rules based profession? Of course they would have done.

What you do is just not that important. Live with it.

[woohoo]

As ever you all seem to think that what you do is more important than it actually is. This pious notion you all seem to have of "quality" is a nonsense. What you are really concerned with is talking yourselves up under the illusion that you somehow deliver "high quality" systems. If I buy a car I am more than happy with a functional skoda. I do not need an Aston martin. If I buy clothes I may get what I pay for but so what?
If lawyers get things wrong then lives and businesses are ruined, same with doctors and accountants. If someone makes a mess of an IT program in a banking system it is the banks responsibility and not the IT person. It is a secondary level function, it is a component of something bigger and as such the risk sits with the ownership of the whole. Law accountancy and health are front line critical services where mistakes cause huge problems.
If IT was so important don't you think that the governments of the world would already have elevated the status of what you do to a fully controlled, rules based profession? Of course they would have done.

What you do is just not that important. Live with it.

I've always had a soft spot for you dodgy but if your logic doesn't improve your never going to drag yourself out of the gutter and become a top notch programmer.

Some pretty bad disasters here.
The top 10 IT disasters of all time | ZDNet

[darmstadt]

As ever you all seem to think that what you do is more important than it actually is. This pious notion you all seem to have of "quality" is a nonsense. What you are really concerned with is talking yourselves up under the illusion that you somehow deliver "high quality" systems. If I buy a car I am more than happy with a functional skoda. I do not need an Aston martin. If I buy clothes I may get what I pay for but so what?
If lawyers get things wrong then lives and businesses are ruined, same with doctors and accountants. If someone makes a mess of an IT program in a banking system it is the banks responsibility and not the IT person. It is a secondary level function, it is a component of something bigger and as such the risk sits with the ownership of the whole. Law accountancy and health are front line critical services where mistakes cause huge problems.
If IT was so important don't you think that the governments of the world would already have elevated the status of what you do to a fully controlled, rules based profession? Of course they would have done.

What you do is just not that important. Live with it.

By that same criteria why should a contractor use a reputable top-notch blue chip agency when a body shop from Chennai will do? Both provide the same service...at different prices

[vetran]

I've always had a soft spot for you dodgy but if your logic doesn't improve your never going to drag yourself out of the gutter and become a top notch programmer.

Some pretty bad disasters here.
The top 10 IT disasters of all time | ZDNet

Those are all because the IT people screwed up, they should have written perfect code, they should have stayed behind and added some extra date codes etc.

You will never see any managers take responsibility for this.

What we do is easy, now driving powerpoint is the real skill.

[BlasterBates]

http://www.zdnet.com/the-top-10-it-d...ime-3039290976

THey were all caused by on-shored developers.

Before offshoring 70% of all IT projects failed (from a presentation I once heard, most of us worked on plenty of failed projects in the 90's). IT Acedemia used to have a term called the "Software Crisis" which was coined in the 1980's, admittedly to justify their research into improving methods.

IF only 50% of offshored projects fail that's still a tremendous improvement.

[DodgyAccountant]

t don't you think that the governments of the world would already have elevated the status of what you do to a fully controlled, rules based profession?

What you do is just not that important. Live with it.

In some ways I agree with you. However

- IT has contributed to gains in productivity which have increased wealth

- It is possible to make a lot of money from IT and there are low barriers to entry

- Not all professions are 'fully controlled, rules based' - e.g. any one can practise as an accountant in the UK

Regards

DA

[vetran]

THey were all caused by on-shored developers.

Before offshoring 70% of all IT projects failed (from a presentation I once heard, most of us worked on plenty of failed projects in the 90's). IT Acedemia used to have a term called the "Software Crisis" which was coined in the 1980's, admittedly to justify their research into improving methods.

IF only 50% of offshored projects fail that's still a tremendous improvement.

define failed?

Improving the success rate of NHS IT projects | IT management | Subject areas | Publishing and editorial | BCS - The Chartered Institute for IT

Study: 68 percent of IT projects fail | ZDNet


Frequently failure is because the act of nailing jelly to a speeding bullet is fraught with risks.

[yetanotherbob]

Have you told Dave Camoron?

He has a real interest in this sort of thing.



The Tories will of course stop Visa abuse and repeal IR35 etc etc etc

This has nothing at all to do with 'this sort of thing' (visa abuse/underhanded tactics by indian IT companies that is..).
At least make the right connection . such as this:
Immigration: David Cameron promises easier visa system for Indians - Telegraph

[Coalman]

As ever you all seem to think that what you do is more important than it actually is. This pious notion you all seem to have of "quality" is a nonsense. What you are really concerned with is talking yourselves up under the illusion that you somehow deliver "high quality" systems. If I buy a car I am more than happy with a functional skoda. I do not need an Aston martin. If I buy clothes I may get what I pay for but so what?
If lawyers get things wrong then lives and businesses are ruined, same with doctors and accountants. If someone makes a mess of an IT program in a banking system it is the banks responsibility and not the IT person. It is a secondary level function, it is a component of something bigger and as such the risk sits with the ownership of the whole. Law accountancy and health are front line critical services where mistakes cause huge problems.
If IT was so important don't you think that the governments of the world would already have elevated the status of what you do to a fully controlled, rules based profession? Of course they would have done.

What you do is just not that important. Live with it.

You are right when you talk about banks. But IT covers so much more than that. Now I'm just a PM/BA so don't do anything other than all the jobs nobody can be arsed with, but IT runs many, many safety critical systems where failure can mean a single cut finger to thousands of deaths.

I hope you're just trying to get people to bite, you can't actually think your sweeping statements apply to everything, can t?

[DodgyAgent]

By that same criteria why should a contractor use a reputable top-notch blue chip agency when a body shop from Chennai will do? Both provide the same service...at different prices

Quite. Contractors (rightly so) will go to whoever gets them the work. We agents take the view that either we compete or we get out of the business.