Freak Weather due to Ice Caps melting

[DS23]

I have never before read such a croc of tulip in my life.

and considering the endless wastes of tulip that can be found in here that is saying something.

[pjclarke]

No ships in the north west passage in the summer ? maybe its not open at all

LOL - You forgot to check the offical supplier of climate science to CUK..

Staggering Arctic map shows how impassable Northwest Passage is opening up as polar ice caps melt

The ice extent minimum occurs in September, and NW Passage will almost certainly be open for a period before and after then, as has happened regularly since 2007, according to the US National Ice and Snow Data Centre:-

Sep 2011 - “Sea ice is now almost completely gone from the channels of the Northwest Passage, with the exception of a small strip of ice across a stretch of the Parry Channel. The southern route (Amunden's Route) is ice free. According to the Canadian Ice Service, sea ice extent in the western Parry Channel is now the lowest at this time of year since record keeping began in 1966 and very little multi-year ice remains.”

Oct 2010 - "The U.S. National Ice Center declared both the Northwest Passage and the Northern Sea Route open for a period during September. Stephen Howell of Environment Canada reported a record early melt-out and low extent in the western Parry Channel region of the Northwest Passage, based on analyses of the Canadian Ice Service."

Aug 2008 - “The direct route through the Northwest Passage...is currently almost free of ice, while the indirect route, called the Amundsen Northwest Passage, has been passable for almost a month. This is the second year in a row that the most direct route through the Northwest Passage has opened up.”

Summer 2008 - "This year marked the first time since satellite measurements began in the 1970s that the Northern Sea Route, also known as the Northeast Passage, and the Northwest Passage were both open at the same time for a few weeks."

Summer 2007 - “Arctic sea ice receded so much that the fabled Northwest Passage completely opened for the first time in human memory.”

So not much of a debunk, really. The evidence for the melting ice, well, that would be the melting ice:

[sasguru]

I'm a bit lost by this EO me old mukka.

There's always been ships through the NW passage in summer, they use icebreakers in other seasons too dont they?

(I've done that trip quite a few times , as its the main commuter route for residents of Juneau to get back to mainland USA)

I'm missing the point I think.

There isn't one. Not a rational, objective or logical one anyway.

[minestrone]

The data is pretty strongly suggesting the gulf stream is changing and we are possibly moving towards Scandinavian winters which hardly any of our housing stock is capable of surviving and just as we are about to move towards an energy crisis. Nobody seems to get that.

[BlasterBates]

But can you differentiate the affects of the climate on the UK caused by "global warming" from the entirely natural Atlantic Multidecadal Oscillation?

Atlantic muti-decadal Oscillation

This is a key driver in climate change in the UK. Due to the fact that it isn´t fully inderstood means no-one can say that the changes you witness aren´t as a result of this phenomenen. Of course one can imagine that this can have effects on the Gulfstream. Certainly the Atlantic off the coast of Britain periodically cooling and warming is going to have a prodound effect on the local climate.

It´s probably not a surprise that the current cool summer is happening as the AMO moves into it´s negative phase.

One of the key misunderstandings is the idea that in the past nothing changed. Of course it did; the question is are the changes we´re seeing today any different than changes seen in the past.

The dust bowl in the US in the 1930´s is a prime example of how unprecedented climate conditions can occur. One can imagine attributing this to climate change had it happened today.

[Old Hack]

I am starting to think you only have one way of debating, and that is, its my way or I shall not listen to you, and talk over the top of you.

[shaunbhoy]

I am starting to think

Well you've kept THAT under wraps. What has prompted this epiphany?

[EternalOptimist]

I am starting to think you only have one way of debating, and that is, its my way or I shall not listen to you, and talk over the top of you.

If you read the title of the thread, it implies a causal link. Cause and effect. BB is very sensibly pointing out that there are other possible causes, and we dont know enough to be sure about the little we think we are sure of.

Ignorance is a part of the human condition, luckily there is a cure. Stupidity is also a part of the human condition, but I am afraid we dont have a cure for that at all

[sasguru]

If you read the title of the thread, it implies a causal link. Cause and effect. BB is very sensibly pointing out that there are other possible causes, and we dont know enough to be sure about the little we think we are sure of.Ignorance is a part of the human condition, luckily there is a cure. Stupidity is also a part of the human condition, but I am afraid we dont have a cure for that at all

Who's this we? Cretins who didn't do too well at school?
Not everyone's opinion is equally valid.
You're right about stupidity though, there is no cure. Posting bollox doesn't cure it either.

HTH

[shaunbhoy]

You're right about stupidity though, there is no cure. Posting bollox doesn't cure it either.HTH

Though God knows you've tried!!