Vegan

[doodab]

The problem with malnutrition is not caused by the vegan diet, you can eat nothing but chips and say you are vegan. There are plenty of families whose kids are obese because they have been given fast food or processed crap. You can get all the nutrients you need from a vegan diet. Please no more one off stories, post some scientific papers at least.

I already pointed out that this is not possible without supplements or "fortified" products. How about if Vegan Outreach try and impress this fact upon you instead? There are a few other things you might want to pay attention to as well as the vitamin B12 and omega-3 fatty acids already mentioned.

What Every Vegan Should Know About B12

Omega-3

Bones, Vitamin D, and Calcium

Iodine

Protein

It is very hard to design a vegan diet that meets lysine requirements for a person who does not exercise daily without including legumes, quinoa, or pistachios, without having too many calories. It is much easier to do for regular exercisers whose calorie requirements are higher - the low lysine foods will add up to provide enough.

Or perhaps the vegan society?

http://www.vegansociety.com/lifestyle/nutrition/

It is important to provide sources of:

Vitamin B12

Readily available in fortified foods such as yeast extract, soya milk, breakfast cereal and margarine. Daily amount from fortified foods: 3 micrograms. Alternatively a supplement can be provided. Daily amount from a supplement: 10 micrograms.

Iodine

Found in small amounts in green leafy vegetables and in larger amounts in seaweeds such as kelp. Daily amount: 150 micrograms.

Vitamin D

Most Vitamin D comes from sun exposure. If this is limited, foods fortified with vitamin D2 (such as margarine or soya milk) can provide some of the daily requirements, or a supplement can be used. (Note: D3 is not usually suitable for vegans). Daily amount: 10 micrograms.

Omega 3

Daily amount: one heaped tablespoon of ground flaxseed or two tablespoons of rapeseed oil.

Mmmm flaxseed. I'd rather have sushi personally.

[d000hg]

I'm sure the cavemen sorted out fire a few thousand years ago...

Yes. They sorted out hunting animals with weapons too. But the one point on which russell may* not be totally spouting crap is that a few thousand years is pretty short in evolutionary terms.

*not sure though, digestive fauna make a huge difference and can probably change far faster than we actually evolve as a species.

[TimberWolf]

Lots more things will have lived in place of the farmed animals. The meat industry uses huge amounts of land for either grazing or crop growing for feed or just to house the animals.
All of that extra space used to raise the livestock could be turned back over to nature and lots of wild animals could live there instead.

Not big animals. Farming is subsidized by oil and the soil managed, for example by ploughing, and as life begets life, so likely the whole food chain increases, apart from aphids and other pesky crop destroying eating things perhaps.

The local forest I walk through seems almost devoid of anything bigger than a sparrow, though recently I have seen the odd squirrel.

[Spacecadet]

Not big animals. Farming is subsidized by oil and the soil managed, for example by ploughing, and as life begets life, so likely the whole food chain increases, apart from aphids and other pesky crop destroying eating things perhaps.

The local forest I walk through seems almost devoid of anything bigger than a sparrow, though recently I have seen the odd squirrel.

Most of the big animals in Europe have been killed off. If it was not for man there would be several species of deer (in much larger numbers than we have now), wolves and bears.

Biodiversity would also be a lot higher which is never a bad thing

[OwlHoot]

Yes. They sorted out hunting animals with weapons too. But the one point on which russell may* not be totally spouting crap is that a few thousand years is pretty short in evolutionary terms.

*not sure though, digestive fauna make a huge difference and can probably change far faster than we actually evolve as a species.

But a meat and fish diet allowed our ancestors' brains to grow, as less bodily resources were needed for digestion, and it freed them from relying on a consistently fertile environment to find sufficient suitable plant food each day.

So the only scientific justification for becoming vegan would be if one had such a small brain, like a rabbit's say, that it needed hardly any sustenance.

On second thoughts, it makes perfect sense for russell to become a vegan.

[TimberWolf]

Most of the big animals in Europe have been killed off. If it was not for man there would be several species of deer (in much larger numbers than we have now), wolves and bears.

Biodiversity would also be a lot higher which is never a bad thing

The deer population wouldn't be anything like the density of farm animals we have today.

Species are going extinct at a record rate, but that would likely occur without meat eating. Just by weight of human numbers and making life difficult for things that annoy, eat our stuff or kill us.

[Mich the Tester]

But a meat and fish diet allowed our ancestors' brains to grow, as less bodily resources were needed for digestion, and it freed them from relying on a consistently fertile environment to find sufficient suitable plant food each day.

So the only scientific justification for becoming vegan would be if one had such a small brain, like a rabbit's say, that it needed hardly any sustenance.

On second thoughts, it makes perfect sense for russell to become a vegan.

Even rabbits eat some amount of animal protein as there are insects and caterpillars on the plants they eat. They also eat their own turds as they don't have the multiple stomachs of cows for chewing the cud.

Perhaps that's the secret of vegan athletes; eating their own turds.

[NotAllThere]

Most of the big animals in Europe have been killed off. If it was not for man there would be several species of deer (in much larger numbers than we have now), wolves and bears.

Biodiversity would also be a lot higher which is never a bad thing

There are bears and wolves in the Italian alps now.

Even rabbits eat some amount of animal protein as there are insects and caterpillars on the plants they eat. They also eat their own turds as they don't have the multiple stomachs of cows for chewing the cud.

Perhaps that's the secret of vegan athletes; eating their own turds.

It would explain why vegans often talk a load of crap.

[BlasterBates]

I presume probably man evolved from an omnivorous ape like the chimpanzee, which might explain why he needs artificial supplements to survive on a vegan diet.

The Predatory Behavior and Ecology of Wild Chimpanzees

Neanderthals were hunting and eating meat 130 000 years ago.

[russell]

I presume probably man evolved from an omnivorous ape like the chimpanzee, which might explain why he needs artificial supplements to survive on a vegan diet.

The Predatory Behavior and Ecology of Wild Chimpanzees

Neanderthals were hunting and eating meat 130 000 years ago.

They were also bashing women over the head and raping them, I assume you think we should still be doing that?