Sense of Sun Readers

[gingerjedi]

I'm not convinced so far. I have to drive slowly in a country with capital punishment, which is only just on the side of not killing criminals.

I've heard it said that the USA has the best democracy in the world... a country where they do drive slowly and they do kill their criminals.

Are Daily Mail readers in charge?

[Freamon]

I've heard it said that the USA has the best democracy in the world...

Just further proof that there are a lot of idiots out there.

[thunderlizard]

Are Daily Mail readers in charge?

Don't get me started on the Daily Mail. Bunch of ubiquitous-plastic-carrier-bag-hating, justice-for-Stephen-Lawrence-demanding bigots the lot of them.

[gingerjedi]

Just further proof that there are a lot of idiots out there.

Well as pure democracy goes you can't argue with their system as it beats ours hands down, maybe it just goes to show that democracy isn't all it's cracked up to be?

[Freamon]

Well as pure democracy goes you can't argue with their system as it beats ours hands down, maybe it just goes to show that democracy isn't all it's cracked up to be?

Not sure, the freedom and influence enjoyed by lobbyists is a pretty big minus point for them IMO.

[xoggoth]

Sorry but "just under 50%" is enough to convince you? That's the same as "nearly 50% advocate the death penalty"

But it's hardly most backing death without trial as TL suggested. It's a fair balance and the change indicates that sensible convincing arguments may affect it one way or another. Who is to say for sure they are wrong? Not in favour personally but if there was actually evidence that it saved far more innocent lives than it risked or that juries would not shrink from convicting the guilty I might be convinced.

People seem to assume that intelligence and education brings wisdom but where is the evidence? Look at how daft ideologies take over, Nazism, Communism, Islam or whatever. Those things were imposed on us by the leaders and intellectuals as a part of a rigid fanaticism or a way of consolidating their own power and privilege. They take advantage of fear and conflicts and create scapegoats. How many authoritarian states have ever governed wisely with the interest of their people as their main priority? How many competent governments has the UK had in the last century?

In more stable prosperous times there is a reversion to instinct and it is by nature sensible. We object to what threatens us and are tolerant of what does not and this sense permeates most public comment. Hence reducing disapproval of homosexuality, dislike of Islam but not Hinduism or Sikhism, objection to welfare when it is undeserved but sympathy for real disability and utter loathing of Gordon Brown. On the EU people do not talk about some great future world, they ask, quite rightly, what do we get from it?

[d000hg]

I've heard it said that the USA has the best democracy in the world... a country where they do drive slowly and they do kill their criminals.

This is probably said by Americans who don't know how their system works (most of them).

[BlasterBates]

If you want to see what depths the "Intelligentsia" have sunk to just read this:

Naked Bodies and a New Messiah: Green Groups Try to Sex Up Climate Change - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

Incredible how an entire generation of seemingly intelligent people, can end up in mass delusion.

What is it they say, a bit of knowledge is dangerous.

Intelligentsia 0 - Joe Public Sun Reader 10

[gingerjedi]

This is probably said by Americans who don't know how their system works (most of them).

They do have a very strong democratic system, they just choose to vote for idiots and film stars rather than academics and economists.

I guess this is down to the lobbyists as mentioned earlier, shame.

[Gibbon]

That is quite reassuring, and I might have misunderstood the governmental system you're proposing (if, indeed, you were proposing such a thing). I'm sure the relatively silent majority is generally sensible, and now we've got a very focus group-led democracy, our government is probably even more aligned with them than it had been in the past.

(incidentally I don't know what to make of that Telegraph article on the capital punishment survey, as the bulk of the article contradicts the headline. The poll question that seems to have prompted the <50% headline is specifically about the death penalty for murdering a police officer: and this was January 2006, right in the middle of the Stockwell shooting inquiry. The latest YouGov, on a broader question, shows 51% support)

TL you know full well we don't have a democracy in the correct sense of the word. It's an elected oligarchy, we have the power to elect who we want thats all. Once in power they can change their mind, take the country to war, sign treaties with foreign powers.