What actually happens to people who'll lose benefits?

**Mich the Tester** · 20 October 2010, 10:09

Originally posted by d000hg View Post

Bit of a gloomy subject...

All well and good to say they should get a job but lots of people are too useless and nobody would hire them since there'll be people with a work history competing for the same jobs.

Equally valid to say there isn't the money to pay for benefits for so many... I totally agree... but what happens after you take them away?

If you are on housing benefit and it is withdrawn, and you can't get a job in a month or so, you might well find yourself homeless since these people have no savings to fall back on. Will they genuinely find their benefits cut off with nothing else to support them?

So ignoring what such people do or don't deserve, whose fault it is, what should have been done in the past, etc, what will actually happen to said people? Are there examples from other countries who have done similar things?

I think you're right that there are people who simply can't be employed in any useful manner. In the past they would have been locked up in workhouses or sent off to Botany Bay, or sent to beat up natives in the colonies. We don't do those things now, which I believe is a good thing. So some way of looking after those people in a humane and decent way is needed, at the same time as offering them the chance to do something useful when it turns out they can; not easy though. Perhaps we just have to accept that social security and state housing is the price to pay for a peaceful society.

**darmstadt** · 20 October 2010, 10:10

In Germany you cannot benefits unless you have a permanent abode but you can't get a permanent abode unless you have an income

**EternalOptimist** · 20 October 2010, 10:12

There are actually a whole load of people who are already taken off benefits, it happens naturally and all of the time.

People whose kids reach 18, or whose kids get a job, can suddenly find themsleves a LOT worse off. They just have to adjust. One person described this to me (just this am in fact) as 'falling off a cliff'

**AtW** · 20 October 2010, 10:12

Originally posted by darmstadt View Post

In Germany you cannot benefits unless you have a permanent abode but you can't get a permanent abode unless you have an income

Same (in most cases) in the UK - only it's called permanent residence.

**Mich the Tester** · 20 October 2010, 10:15

The Soviets had a Gulag; I'm not sure that would be an acceptable solution.

**vetran** · 20 October 2010, 10:24

It needs to happen.

Not sure how bad it will get depends how its done, but if the move is gradual and combined with welfare to work it makes sense:

USATODAY.com - How welfare reform changed America

Gordon typifies that concern. Between her many jobs, she used up her cash benefits under the five-year time limit imposed by the welfare overhaul. Without work, she lost her federal housing subsidy, which helped pay her rent. So in October, she and three of her kids moved in with her mother. Her oldest son is in jail; she cares for his 6-year-old daughter. The three fathers of her children pay no child support. She gets about $500 a month in food stamps.

These days, the family mows lawns to help make ends meet. "Things are really rough out here," Gordon says. "We do what we need to do to have money."

But it is having a positive effect :

or Michelle Gordon, making ends meet these days depends on two lawn mowers, two trimmers and a broom. "I'm living with my mother. I'm 40 years old," she says.

She uses her experience as a lesson to her children. Daughter Essence, 19, has a high school diploma and a job and is attending college. Son Geno, 17, also has a summer job. Daughter Zoila, 15, says she won't have kids until she's married and established in life. The family gets food stamps, and the youngest two are on Medicaid, but they no longer get cash benefits.

The roller coaster Gordon has been riding for 10 years has made her less dependent on the government and more of a role model for her kids, she says.

"I'm not making $50,000 a year," she says, "but I'm keeping my head up, and I'm surviving."

Have a look at the table at the bottom, now that is impressive. Look at the fall in claimants in Idaho & Illinois.

**MarillionFan** · 20 October 2010, 10:25

Originally posted by Mich the Tester View Post

I think you're right that there are people who simply can't be employed in any useful manner. In the past they would have been locked up in workhouses or sent off to Botany Bay, or sent to beat up natives in the colonies. We don't do those things now, which I believe is a good thing. So some way of looking after those people in a humane and decent way is needed, at the same time as offering them the chance to do something useful when it turns out they can; not easy though. Perhaps we just have to accept that social security and state housing is the price to pay for a peaceful society.

I would suggest we round up all of those who are weak, feckless & useless. We can then create special camps where we can bus them & send them in trains. There they can be with their own. They can be put to use, working on the land, in the camps, giving something back to society. Obviously the army will need to be there to look after them. After all it's their fault the country is the way it is. It would be a great solution.

I wonder if anyone else has had this idea before?

**Mich the Tester** · 20 October 2010, 10:50

Originally posted by zeitghost

Wasn't the last guy a vegetarian or something?

Yeah, Austrian chap; failed art student I think.

**Bunk** · 20 October 2010, 10:52

Originally posted by MarillionFan View Post

I would suggest we round up all of those who are weak, feckless & useless. We can then create special camps where we can bus them & send them in trains. There they can be with their own. They can be put to use, working on the land, in the camps, giving something back to society. Obviously the army will need to be there to look after them. After all it's their fault the country is the way it is. It would be a great solution.

I wonder if anyone else has had this idea before?

I assume work would set them free?

What actually happens to people who'll lose benefits?