Jabberwocky - read carefully

[expat]

Canny feckers, these Swiss, aren't they?

But even they have to be careful. Their government keeps trying to drag them more and more into the EU. Fortunately for the Swiss, they have a constitution that lets them stop that.

I.e. the Swiss government belongs to the Swiss people. Whereas.....

[BlasterBates]

Its actually 2.5 billion, still too much of course The government actually spends over 500 billion, so basically if you tax is 20 grand pulling out of the EU it would reduce the tax bill by about 100 quid a year.

That means if we pulled out the EU we could all be given a free return ticket from London to Manchester.

[Jabberwocky]

I'm right? Must be an off day. Actually I didn't say you earn what you are worth, that could involve worth defined by some wishy washy airy fairy namby pamby arty farty definition

I said that by definition in a free market you are worth what you earn.

This is the sort banal meaningless rhetoric that people spout on here and I that I am here to correct. Take the IT industry, an industry that a few of you pretend to know something about. Here is why you are not worth what you earn in IT:

1. If you are on the bench your worth is nothing.
2. If you have a 100 million quids to invest but little earnings you are worthless.
3. Normal people don't do things for money purely for money so they make take a lower paid job than they could actually get.
4. You one get a one-off contract.
5. Nepotism, cronyism, elitism, facism - people do hiring.
6. You might be overpaid/underpaid relative to the market through variation in salary.
7. There is no such thing a pure free market - politics takes care of that.
8. Worth to whom ? Becks is worth nothing to me, but plenty to Posh
9. Your value to a business is how much many you make them - not how much they pay you.
10. Power. TBs worth is a lot more than his earnings - as soon as he leave no. 10 he will earn a lot more than he does now.

It is a meaningless trite definition bourne out of ignorance and sexual frustration. Please stop using it.

[BoredBloke]

"You one get a one-off contract."

What the hell does that mean?

[Dundeegeorge]

Yada yada 4 legs good 2 legs bad yada yada

This is the sort banal meaningless rhetoric that people spout on here and I that I am here to correct. Take the IT industry, an industry that a few of you pretend to know something about. Here is why you are not worth what you earn in IT:

1. If you are on the bench your worth is nothing.
2. If you have a 100 million quids to invest but little earnings you are worthless.
3. Normal people don't do things for money purely for money so they make take a lower paid job than they could actually get.
4. You one get a one-off contract.
5. Nepotism, cronyism, elitism, facism - people do hiring.
6. You might be overpaid/underpaid relative to the market through variation in salary.
7. There is no such thing a pure free market - politics takes care of that.
8. Worth to whom ? Becks is worth nothing to me, but plenty to Posh
9. Your value to a business is how much many you make them - not how much they pay you.
10. Power. TBs worth is a lot more than his earnings - as soon as he leave no. 10 he will earn a lot more than he does now.

It is a meaningless trite definition bourne out of ignorance and sexual frustration. Please stop using it.

Get back into your apron and flip those burgers.

[Jabberwocky]

"You one get a one-off contract."

What the hell does that mean?

Clue is in the name Tony, bit like the word as*hole.

[EternalOptimist]

jabber the hut

we are contactors here, this is a contractor web site.

if I get four contracts a year, at 20k a pop , I say to myself 'mm, I'm worth 80k a year'

I sortof take into account all the variables, I'd be an idiot not to. so whats yer point

[xoggoth]

Worth to whom ? Becks is worth nothing to me, but plenty to Posh

That just shows you have totally failed to grasp the point. Worth is not some relative measure judged by artistic value or merit according to some arcane judgement, it is absolute and measured only by income. If either you or Posh or the football fans or uncle Tom Cobbley or Saddam Hussain had paid him his 40k a week or whatever it is then he is worth it by definition.

It is quite true that the free market does not operate throughout society. It does not operate when wealth is used to create priviledge. In the latter it is not just about the wealthy and powerful be able to afford more, it is about the wealthy and powerful using their riches and power to exclude others.

However, the case of Beckham you cite is as near a case of true market forces in operation as any one can think of. He earns what he does because, quite regardless of his sporting merit (on which I cannot comment as I know FA about football) people will pay to see him. Once he becomes useless and people are no longer interested in him the money will diminish very rapidly.

9. Your value to a business is how much many you make them - not how much they pay you.

We are not talking about the money somebody generates for others, but about the income they have. If the two are not related perhaps a) the business is an idiot b) They are sensible enough to take advantage of an idiot. But again you miss the point. If you save them millions per annum and only get £20 an hour you are worth precisely the latter figure. You can't sell yourself properly. Tough.

[Fungus]

"This is the sort banal meaningless rhetoric that people spout on here and I that I am here to correct."

What does "and I that I am here to correct" mean?

"If you are on the bench your worth is nothing."

What does that mean?

"Normal people don't do things for money purely for money so they make take a lower paid job than they could actually get."

Poor grammar. But the meaning creeps through. Just. Most people do work to earn money and the amount is important.

"You one get a one-off contract."

What does that mean?

"Nepotism, cronyism, elitism, facism - people do hiring."

Que?

"You might be overpaid/underpaid relative to the market through variation in salary."

I am always overpaid compared to permies. That's why I contract.

"Your value to a business is how much many you make them - not how much they pay you."

A statement of the bleedin' obvious but what point are you trying to make?

"It is a meaningless trite definition bourne out of ignorance and sexual frustration. Please stop using it."

Your spelling is BORN out of ignorance of the English language. I'm not sure what point you wish to make.

You know Cock-Jockey you are not an IT contractor are you?

If you were, you would know that most companies operate on the bulltulip principle. They try to employ the most capable people that they can, persuade them that they are not worth much and must try harder, and squeeze as much as they can out of them. That includes working unpaid overtime. Some companies stress their employees so much that they suffer physical and/or mental illness. Basically you are just one resource to be used as and when needed.

Whereas if you are an IT contractor, you do the same sort of work as permies, but get paid twice as much, you are treated with much more respect, and you get to learn new tricks. And there's much less politics to worry about as you are not competition for permies.

Anyway, that's my experience. But then again I'm good at what I do. Maybe you're not which is why you are so full of hatred and envy.

So, get a contract, earn some money, and drop that socialist bulltulip nonsense. Don't thank me now but you will.

Fungus

[Jabberwocky]

Let's go to the dictionary fu*kwits:

worth

The quality that renders something desirable, useful, or valuable: the worth of higher education.
Material or market value: stocks having a worth of ten million dollars.
A quantity of something that may be purchased for a specified sum or by a specified means: ten dollars' worth of natural gas; wanted their money's worth.
Wealth; riches: her net worth.
Quality that commands esteem or respect; merit: a person of great worth.

As you can see there are a number of definitions, and the free market is never mentioned. Xog's trite little definition is simplistic claptrap. I suggest you all get back to your little contracting w*nkfest.

Oh yes I am an IT contractor actually, just one with a little vision to see beyond one line definitions.