Bring back Maggie

[Mich the Tester]

But the current situation has been created not by the free-markets but by the banks, which are not free-markets at all. They are driven by Governments setting the interest rates at which they can borrow money and by thousands of regulations enforced by quango's such as the FSA.

If banks were truly allowed to be free-market players then the weak banks would have been gobbled up years ago by the better run ones before they gave away money they hadn't got to people who couldn't pay. As it is the banks were allowed to practice in a non-free market way because the regulations meant that sound finances were not the primary concern of either the banks or of the shareholders.

over leveraged

[tay]

I dont like Thatcher, or hate Thatcher.... but I do think it is idiocy to blame a prime minister from 20 years ago for the current slump.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Is that really the best you can do?

Well at least it's a serious point based on facts rather than some old tosh about middle class guilt. She (and many of her supporters - as illustrated by the post I was answering) cared for democracy only as long as it led to her rule. She increased the level of deposits required to stand in elections and destroyed local democracy.

[minestrone]

Well at least it's a serious point based on facts rather than some old tosh about middle class guilt. She (and many of her supporters - as illustrated by the post I was answering) cared for democracy only as long as it led to her rule. She increased the level of deposits required to stand in elections and destroyed local democracy.

Can I call for a point of information on that, if you are going to continue to talk complete tulip them someone has to call you on it.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Can I call for a point of information on that, if you are going to continue to talk complete tulip them someone has to call you on it.

Well, as you're raising it, you'd better "call me on it".

[Cyberman]

It's all Thatcher's fault that the National Debt will be a trillion pounds in a couple of years.

[d000hg]

It's all Thatcher's fault that the National Debt will be a trillion pounds in a couple of years.

A trillion is just another number.

[DodgyAgent]

Well at least it's a serious point based on facts rather than some old tosh about middle class guilt. She (and many of her supporters - as illustrated by the post I was answering) cared for democracy only as long as it led to her rule. She increased the level of deposits required to stand in elections and destroyed local democracy.

Well if it is not mysoginy or middle class guilt that makes you overlook the fact that your personal wealth is entirely attributable to her reforms then what is it? you can chuck as many cliches about democracy in as you like but your hypocrisy still stinks

[Board Game Geek]

Minestrone posted That was because those industries where taking the piss, the nation was buggered over a barrel because of the miners, they shafted Ted Heath with their demands of 40% pay rise. The whole of British Leyland night shift were sleeping in tents out the back of the factory. This was all going on while the state was paying for these companies to operate.

Someone had to put a stop to it and that person was never going to be popular.

Agreed. However some people who are rabid anti-Thatcherites will disagree.

So let's appease them.

Let's pretend Maggie acquiesced to the Unions and gave them what they wanted.

What would have happened ?

Massive increase in taxes to pay for their parasitic demands as they continued to bleed the country dry.

However, we keep nationalised industries going for another 10-15 years.

Then, quite independently from the UK, the Taiwanese / Chinese Industrialization blossoms, the US and most of Europe off-shore their production, leaving GB with state-funded companies that are bankrupted by colossal labour costs selling expensive goods.

In other words, Thatcher was damned if she did, and damned if she didn't.

You want a culprit ?

Globalisation.

Who is responsible for globalisation ?

We all are.

[DodgyAgent]

Agreed. However some people who are rabid anti-Thatcherites will disagree.

So let's appease them.

Let's pretend Maggie acquiesced to the Unions and gave them what they wanted.

What would have happened ?

Massive increase in taxes to pay for their parasitic demands as they continued to bleed the country dry.

However, we keep nationalised industries going for another 10-15 years.

Then, quite independently from the UK, the Taiwanese / Chinese Industrialization blossoms, the US and most of Europe off-shore their production, leaving GB with state-funded companies that are bankrupted by colossal labour costs selling expensive goods.

In other words, Thatcher was damned if she did, and damned if she didn't.

You want a culprit ?

Globalisation.

Who is responsible for globalisation ?

We all are.

You started off well, but I am not sure that globalisation is such a bad thing as it gives opportunities for countries to trade with each other. However the sight of a Tesco in every corner of the globe terrifies me.

Had Thatcher not done what she did then the UK would have prospered as a cheap offshoring IT centre. The bonus would have been that most of us would now be multi lingual, with the ability to speak Hindi, Mandarin etc etc. The UK would have been less crowded as the Brits would have flooded out to countries such as Somalia and Poland in search of jobs and a better lifestyle.

Those of us left would have secure jobs digging up coal and making spare parts for Morris Minors and Austin Maxis.

Fewer immigrants from the middle East would have meant the UK not being a target for Al Quaeda.

So you anti Thatcherites were right all along