Defund this Policeman?

[Gibbon]

How many millionaires rob houses, mug old grannies, shoplift or joy ride cars?

Millionaires don't do high risk low return crime - Bernie Madoff - Wikipedia

[vetran]

Boy was shot for refusing to join a gang, mother says | UK news | The Guardian

The story is in other papers (The Times) but behind paywall. On these sink estates there is massive (sic) pressure to join gangs.

Yes but that isn't poverty its because the Police are not closing the gangs down.

If you allow gangs to flourish then they recruit.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...r-aides-guilty

Five former employees of Bernie Madoff were found guilty of conspiracy on Monday as a jury ruled they had for years helped conceal his massive Ponzi scheme.

The verdicts are the first jury convictions since Madoff’s $20bn scam was exposed six years ago, and come after a trial that lasted nearly six months.

Prosecutors argued that the defendants enriched themselves while they helped Madoff cheat investors and dupe government regulators. The decades-long scam came to an end in December 2008 when Madoff ran out of money and was arrested.

[Whorty]

Millionaires don't do high risk low return crime - Bernie Madoff - Wikipedia

Most crime, I would say, is about risk and reward. If you have nothing to lose, then shoplifting a pack of fags, or mugging someone in the street may be deemed low risk compared to the reward. Even if caught, it's not like they can take anything off you if you have nothing to be taken.

Give people something to value that they don't want to lose, then you can reduce crime. There is no quick fix though, and unlikely to be achieved in any one single parliament, so there is no incentive for a government to try too hard as they may not be in power when successes are seen.

[_V_]

Govt should pay criminals not to commit crimes. I would suggest £350/day for everyone that isn't committing crime.

[Whorty]

Govt should pay criminals not to commit crimes. I would suggest £350/day for everyone that isn't committing crime.

Is that inside or outside rate?

[vetran]

Most crime, I would say, is about risk and reward. If you have nothing to lose, then shoplifting a pack of fags, or mugging someone in the street may be deemed low risk compared to the reward. Even if caught, it's not like they can take anything off you if you have nothing to be taken.

Give people something to value that they don't want to lose, then you can reduce crime. There is no quick fix though, and unlikely to be achieved in any one single parliament, so there is no incentive for a government to try too hard as they may not be in power when successes are seen.

Key word in there is GIVE, a free gift is rarely valued. All for providing help for them to EARN respect and things of value.

As you mention risk/reward having a minimum £200 for shop lifting to become a crime lowers risk, non custodial sentences for violent offences similar.

By all means identify troubled people and support them to build a better life. However mot prison commentators do suggest inmates are normally a mix of Sad, Mad or Bad. Fixing the sad before they get there is a reasonable aim. The Mad need healthcare. the Bad need to be terrified of being caught and locked up to keep them away from decent people.

Shoplifting seems to include all 3 prisoner types, so a complex solution is required.

https://www.psychotherapynetworker.o...clinical-issue

Mugging does seem to be an acquisitive crime so push up the risk and reduce the reward. Leverage our CCTV and stop & search. Educate people to avoid mugging areas. Lock up offenders so they can't reoffend. I happy for people who commit fraud to be tagged and reduced to paupers to make space for a mugger.
https://popcenter.asu.edu/content/street-robbery-0

Recidivism is a big issue lets look at other countries and see how they achieve rates half of ours.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...tes-by-country

You miss the issue that the poor are more likely to be victims of crime.

[Whorty]

Key word in there is GIVE, a free gift is rarely valued. All for providing help for them to EARN respect and things of value.

As you mention risk/reward having a minimum £200 for shop lifting to become a crime lowers risk, non custodial sentences for violent offences similar.

By all means identify troubled people and support them to build a better life. However mot prison commentators do suggest inmates are normally a mix of Sad, Mad or Bad. Fixing the sad before they get there is a reasonable aim. The Mad need healthcare. the Bad need to be terrified of being caught and locked up to keep them away from decent people.

Shoplifting seems to include all 3 prisoner types, so a complex solution is required.

https://www.psychotherapynetworker.o...clinical-issue

Mugging does seem to be an acquisitive crime so push up the risk and reduce the reward. Leverage our CCTV and stop & search. Educate people to avoid mugging areas. Lock up offenders so they can't reoffend. I happy for people who commit fraud to be tagged and reduced to paupers to make space for a mugger.
https://popcenter.asu.edu/content/street-robbery-0

Recidivism is a big issue lets look at other countries and see how they achieve rates half of ours.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...tes-by-country

You miss the issue that the poor are more likely to be victims of crime.

You want to fine people who have nothing, £200? Interesting. How do you think they will get the money to pay the fine?

As for me missing the issue that the poor are more likely to be victims of crime, how did you work that out? You've made that up my little friend.

As you seem to have all the answers, why don't you do your civic duty and go educate the police, judges, MPs? You have it all worked out, I'm sure for your day rate of £300 they'd be happy to pay you for a week to get this all sorted

[Whorty]

Key word in there is GIVE, a free gift is rarely valued. All for providing help for them to EARN respect and things of value.

We are all 'given' free education up to the age of 18 - do you not value educating your kids or do you think only those who can afford to send their kids to private school value education?

Everyone should be 'given' the opportunity to succeed in this country, not just those who's parents have deep pockets or good connections. Education and opportunities need to be leveled up. 'Give' those in the poorer areas of our society something to aim for. 'Give' them hopes and aspirations.

This can only be done by education. Kids in these poor areas need to know that they have a chance to do better for themselves. They need to know that being an accountant, lawyer, VB4 programmer, are all careers they can aspire to. They need to be learn on the value of the education and the future earnings/lifestyle that could come from that.

I speak from experience. I grew up on one of these sink estates in the Midlands. Out of 330 kids in my year less than 10 of us ended up with degrees. I was in the top class, yet friends of mine in that class 35 years later have not reached anywhere near their potential. This is not because they couldn't, or I was better, it's because they didn't know what opportunities were out there. I got to where I am due to pure luck. But luck shouldn't come into it - kids from well off families are 'given' opportunities that poorer families just don't have access to.

So 'give' doesn't mean handouts. It doesn't mean 'giving' someone a few hundred quid each week. I hope you can understand that?

[vetran]

You want to fine people who have nothing, £200? Interesting. How do you think they will get the money to pay the fine?

As for me missing the issue that the poor are more likely to be victims of crime, how did you work that out? You've made that up my little friend.

As you seem to have all the answers, why don't you do your civic duty and go educate the police, judges, MPs? You have it all worked out, I'm sure for your day rate of £300 they'd be happy to pay you for a week to get this all sorted

Ah you don't actually read my posts you just type whatever tulip you think of that explains a lot. Then you know nothing about the subject.
The police decided a few years ago that they wouldn't be involved if the value of the stolen goods is <£200 so the professional thieves just steal £195 at a time. Best the store can do is ban them.
Note I gave you links to world renowned experts explaining that shop lifting is not about money for many offenders.

Try this:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42492488

No see the Civitas link in my earlier post they made it up after lots of research. Something you should try.

But people I know in poorer areas are burgled more often and more likely to be victims of Antisocial behaviour. My house has cameras and an alarm as do my neighbours when someone is burgled the Police turn up. When we lived in a poorer area we couldn't get the Police to ttend.

Hey if you still aspire to £300 day rate I'm pleased for you. I used to charge twice that 20 years ago.

They don't need me they just need to read the links I found and grow a pair.

[Whorty]

Ah you don't actually read my posts

See, you can be correct when you try hard enough

I used to charge twice that 20 years ago.

Can anyone else smell something male cow related?

They don't need me

No one needs you my friend.