Thatcher 'saddened' by Pinochet death

[sasguru]

National productivity doesn't measure up though, when you consider the unemployment rate as well (10%, almost double the UK). Yes France can produce high quality products, but as you said the extra effort costs, and it costs the unemployed in France jobs. Of course there is some business instinct, but there is also a government culture which is opposed to competition and which featherbeds existing industries, especially utilities. France's internet takeup rates did not start to catch up with the US, UK, Australia until the late 1990s, France has been dragged kicking and screaming into every new EU liberalisation like telecommunications and aviation.

French subsidies are far less than the US, and France is number one villain on agricultural subsidisation, screwing the efficient world producers in Aus/NZ/Argentina and developing countries, while sucking up taxpayers money from richer European countries for the privilege of inefficiently producing cheese etc. It is the world's second largest agricultural exporter as a result of Europe proppping it up.

Just because the UK screwed up its manufacturing sector with ever poorer quality and higher protection and subsidies, doesn't mean it is right.

The USA does actually produce more cars, planes and railway equipment than the French. French car manufacturers are mid sized and successful, more than UK ones, but Airbus is a big featherbedded European subsidised competitor for Boeing. It produces some very good planes, but never has to raise much private capital to do it.

Have to admit French quality of life has a lot to do with culture and attitude, and appreciation of enjoying life rather than moaning but still accepting mediocrity. (ie Britain)

1.6% growth last year is hardly thriving, when inflation is 1.8% - it's called standing still! Public debt at 67.6% of GDP is far from healthy (43.1% in UK). 20th in GDP per capita (purchasing power parity measure), below UK, Australia and USA.

Just one point there - the UK unemployment rate is NOT 5%, do some research and get the real figures.
While you are right about the flaws in the French system , particularly public debt, if I was French I would want the system tweaked rather than follow the UK model uncritically. They are doing plenty of things right and the proof of the pudding is that most of the French graduates I know in the UK can't wait to go back.

Right now the quality of life in this country is the worst it's been in modern times.

[Cowboy Bob]

*snip loads of economic b0llocks*

You must be fun at parties

Anyway, to be honest, the average Joe on the street doesn't care about GDP or any of that rubbish. That's for the people who work in the city who seem to get paid high salaries to compensate for their boring jobs.

All that matters is that the country "feels" like it's doing well and that everything you aspire to is within reach. That is the case in France. I doubt you'll find many who would argue the same about the UK.

[Lucy]

Just because you can't win the argument with facts there is no need for personal attacks...but then again, what else would we expect on this board.

[Bagpuss]

Just because you can't win the argument with facts there is no need for personal attacks...but then again, what else would we expect on this board.

It's better to cut out the middle man and go straight to the insults!

[sasguru]

Just because you can't win the argument with facts there is no need for personal attacks...but then again, what else would we expect on this board.

I don't see the personal "attack"?
Just because you lost the argument doesn't mean that you need to resort to claiming persoanl attacks.

[shaunbhoy]

Right now the quality of life in this country is the worst it's been in modern times.

Well why don't you bugger off to France then if its so bleeding wonderful instead of whining on here about Blighty's problems? You can then stuff your gormless slack-jawed face with rotten cheese to tone your breath down. And take that moth-eaten old windbag of a cat with you too!!

[DodgyAgent]

French productivity is deemed high because the cost of land is so low. With this huge advantage at its diposal (more so than any other G7 countries) it should be doing a lot better. France is fighting a battle to maintain its social structure and its ability to compete in global markets. To date it has achieved what is effectively "managing the status quo" (virtually no growth for nearly a decade) by manipulating the EU. Its businesses are underpinned by no or little competition at home that enables it to invest in business abroad that give them strong returns.

France protects its own markets whilst competing aggressively in overseas markets. France has huge numbers of unemployed especially amongst the young. What is worse is that to change this the whole way that France is structured (anti competitive business, employment laws, farm subsidies etc) will need to change as there are no new jobs from entrepreneurs/overseas business investors being created.

France is treading water and it sees its survival by exerting control over markets and the EU. And we all know what happens to control freaks.

It is indeed a beautiful country with an economy that works because the French have great civic pride. Their public services therefore work, because public sector jobs are held (and protected) with great pride.

France as we know it will not survive much longer once its labour and commercial markets are thrown open by pressure from the ever enlarging EU accession states.

The question of whether France is a better place to live most certainly depends upon what you want France for.

[shaunbhoy]

The question of whether France is a better place to live most certainly depends upon what you want France for.

Might I suggest Target Practice?

[sasguru]

Well why don't you bugger off to France then if its so bleeding wonderful instead of whining on here about Blighty's problems? You can then stuff your gormless slack-jawed face with rotten cheese to tone your breath down. And take that moth-eaten old windbag of a cat with you too!!

Ah yes the emotional, illogical squaddie returns. I'll be doing my bit by voting against this incompetent bunch of buffoons. Till then I reserve the right to moan and whinge as I see fit.
And yes eventually I will go and live in France and leave you to subsidise my adopted country's agriculture, shipbuilding and aviation while living in your cesspit

[DodgyAgent]

Just one point there - the UK unemployment rate is NOT 5%, do some research and get the real figures.
While you are right about the flaws in the French system , particularly public debt, if I was French I would want the system tweaked rather than follow the UK model uncritically. They are doing plenty of things right and the proof of the pudding is that most of the French graduates I know in the UK can't wait to go back.

Right now the quality of life in this country is the worst it's been in modern times.

you have just completely contradicted yourself. How can a country possibly be attractive to live if there are no jobs? The only things that the French are doing right is living in the most beautiful country on the planet.

graduates cant wait to go back? . But what is the point of returning to the best country (in terms of looks and climate) in the world if there are no jobs!!