Professional Working Day

[MrMarkyMark]

Seems you have strong views on this, even to it being a deal breaker, so, I have to ask why didn't you raise it with the client at the interview stage?

[northernladuk]

Appreciate your take on it, we can agree to disagree. Maybe it's time I retired from this industry lol.

To be honest I'm not disagreeing. I just think it's a bit of a 'perfect' view and on the ground it's just not always like that so just to me it's not about enforcing my views and getting in a pickle when it doesn't go my way. It's just a matter of weighing each gig up on it's merits and getting on with it if I'm OK with it. Some gigs are good, some are utter tripe but in the bigger picture the odd bad one just become another story to tell.

[WTFH]

A few questions:
1. Are you on an hourly rate or a daily rate?
2. Is your contract project-specific?
3. Does your contract specify a total number of days or is it a number of weeks/months/something else?

[gables]

I find that flexibility is often still there even with the '8 hours a day' clause. I also like the protection it gives from being expected to work a regular 8+ hour day.

Yup agree with Cojak, 'professional working day' is just too open to interpretation as evidenced on previous discussions about it on here. And if I'm honest OP you sound a bit prima donnerish, and a bit arrogant about 'Companies need to be dragged into a new way of thinking' - really? (which isn't that new, my wife was wfh in 1994) You're a supplier, it's their business, if you don't like it find another client.

A few questions:
1. Are you on an hourly rate or a daily rate?
2. Is your contract project-specific?
3. Does your contract specify a total number of days or is it a number of weeks/months/something else?

Despite what I said above these are good questions, the answers to which would have a bearing.

[kevpuk]

I have 'Professional Working Day' stipulated as 8hrs in the contract, and then further clauses indicating that 0-4hrs billable as Half Day and 4+ as Full Day......slightly ambiguous, but hey-ho!

ClientCo permies nominally work a 7.25hr day, and I tend to aim to accrue 36.25hrs throughout the working week, but this is normally made up of whatever it takes to get stuff done. Most of the time, I tend to work longer days when in the office Mon-Wed/Thu, and shorter when WFH.......

Guess it all depends on ClientCo and your relationship with them? Besides, I am paid a Day Rate, and hence - even with the ambiguity in contract terms (see above) I bill for a day. Only exception to that is a clause I had inserted to cover weekend/public holiday working, which is very very rare, where I charge a calculated premium hourly rate

[psychocandy]

As long as client doesnt think PWD = 10 hours minimum. Had this in an interview once - find some other mug

[FrontEnder]

My current contract and previous one stipulated a PWD as 8 hours, but both have been flexible. I'm on site mon-thu and WFH friday, so I arrive late monday, finish early thursday.

I personally ask at the interview stage, but not in the demanding prima donna way that it sounds like you're doing. I did this for my current one, and they were fine as long as it adds up to 40 hours, so I wasn't particularly bothered when I got the contract saying 8 hours. I actually think this clause is there to state the maximum billable hours rather than I have to work 8 hours a day. So it if I do 12 hours, I can't bill pro-rata hourly rate * 12.

[northernladuk]

My current contract and previous one stipulated a PWD as 8 hours, but both have been flexible. I'm on site mon-thu and WFH friday, so I arrive late monday, finish early thursday.

I personally ask at the interview stage, but not in the demanding prima donna way that it sounds like you're doing. I did this for my current one, and they were fine as long as it adds up to 40 hours, so I wasn't particularly bothered when I got the contract saying 8 hours. I actually think this clause is there to state the maximum billable hours rather than I have to work 8 hours a day. So it if I do 12 hours, I can't bill pro-rata hourly rate * 12.

What bellfrontender says.

[billybiro]

You are wrong about the IR35 aspect. Adhering to clients requirements has very little to do with IR35 and more to do with professional courtesy.

Are you absolutely sure about that?

What if the "client's requirements" involve asserting S, D & C over you?

[northernladuk]

Are you absolutely sure about that?

What if the "client's requirements" involve asserting S, D & C over you?

Well that is true but I just don't see complying with a clients request to attend site between hours that they generally adhere to being D&C. You can probably say no and get away with something different, like 30 mins early or 30 mins later but you don't you come in as requested to be polite and not cause an issue. Hard to argue that is D&C then.

When they say the interview is at x time you are there on the dot. Is that SD&C? So why not when they ask you to attend at 9 on the first morning?

The other aspect is flexibility is applied once you start so ceases to be D&C.

If it's linked to other things the client wants then yes it might be an SDC problem. On it's own I don't think it is.

This thread discusses timekeeping and mentions many of the points I'm probably making very badly.

http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...e-keeping.html