So who did BA outsource their IT to?

[Cirrus]

Our you sure it isn't:
"Sue, too whom does BA outsource it's IT?"

FTFY

[RSoles]

Meanwhile, back at the ranch.....

Bow to the goddess of FOD!
British Airways bag is blown along runway by jet engine | Daily Mail Online
OK, Daily Wail alert!

[Cirrus]

Ah - the pleasure of well formed run books

we seem to have a mutual appreciation society going on here!

Not surprising, given how good looking we both are.

It is a shame organisations don't take this thing seriously. It's the sort of thing contractors would be good at, and happy to be paid attractive rates to carefully design, construct and test.

Instead of that, of course, organisations hire armies of people to royally clog up what's laughingly known as 'agile'.

[original PM]

Not surprising, given how good looking we both are.

It is a shame organisations don't take this thing seriously. It's the sort of thing contractors would be good at, and happy to be paid attractive rates to carefully design, construct and test.

Instead of that, of course, organisations hire armies of people to royally clog up what's laughingly known as 'agile'.

Agile just means an iterative way to do things rather than commiting to something 2 years before you deliver it and then cutting out the which were in the project budget.

Like some form of dr plan.

Wankshafts at the top making decisions they never have to see the consequences of.

[WTFH]

Agile just means an iterative way to do things ...

A bit like BS5750.
It had nothing to do with doing something well, or using good business practices, and everything to do with fully documenting a bad process, and being rewarded for having documented in precise detail why your company was going to go down the pan, but at least you were BS5750 accredited so you went down the pan in the way you said you would.

[original PM]

A bit like BS5750.
It had nothing to do with doing something well, or using good business practices, and everything to do with fully documenting a bad process, and being rewarded for having documented in precise detail why your company was going to go down the pan, but at least you were BS5750 accredited so you went down the pan in the way you said you would.

As i once said to a company who managed me out the door based in documentation deficits.

You will just end up with lots of documents telling you why you have not delivered the project.

That came true 😃

[BigRed]

I'm old enough to have lived through the various cycles, it's all down to people with the right attitude in the end, with management normally totally missing the point and encouraging you to screw it up. First you have developers who release things to production without proper documentation or disaster recovery, this is partly done to meet deadlines and also because they don't understand repeatable testing. Next it is realised that all the systems require too much nursing and the developers are continuously doing maintenance. You split the team into Production Support and Development with acceptance criteria to move from Development to Production.

Production becomes more stable but the the friction is in the release to Production, where the Production team insist on documentation and a transition period where it becomes apparent that the whole thing is totally fragile with no thought of resilience or robustness, the Development team want to meet their deadlines.

In comes DevOps where the specialists disappear and everyone pitches in to get something released. The old mantra of Right First Time is completely turned over into get something out there and we'll keep fixing it. The next step will be realising that you need some highly skilled production staff whose role is to look at performance, DR, and security.

There's good ideas in all the approaches but it needs staff who try to to do the right thing rather than meet management targets.

[NotAllThere]

....and 60% of its lexicon is latin based

65% Germanic. 25% Latin.

[SueEllen]

I'm old enough to have lived through the various cycles, it's all down to people with the right attitude in the end, with management normally totally missing the point and encouraging you to screw it up. First you have developers who release things to production without proper documentation or disaster recovery, this is partly done to meet deadlines and also because they don't understand repeatable testing. Next it is realised that all the systems require too much nursing and the developers are continuously doing maintenance. You split the team into Production Support and Development with acceptance criteria to move from Development to Production.

Production becomes more stable but the the friction is in the release to Production, where the Production team insist on documentation and a transition period where it becomes apparent that the whole thing is totally fragile with no thought of resilience or robustness, the Development team want to meet their deadlines.

In comes DevOps where the specialists disappear and everyone pitches in to get something released. The old mantra of Right First Time is completely turned over into get something out there and we'll keep fixing it. The next step will be realising that you need some highly skilled production staff whose role is to look at performance, DR, and security.

There's good ideas in all the approaches but it needs staff who try to to do the right thing rather than meet management targets.

You employ young staff because their answer is always "yes". Older staff will point out security issues etc.

Btw not all companies who use DevOps have tulip delivery pipelines. They have processes in place to ensure that anything that fails testing at different stages e.g. pre-production is not put on to production servers.

[northernladyuk]

65% Germanic. 25% Latin.

That sounds more like a description of word usage? 60% of lexicon as Latin is about right as it includes uncommon technical words. So it is not a very useful figure in this context.