Junior doctors

[BlasterBates]

Or 10k per household if both work. Still seems quite expensive to me!

If you get a quote from a private health insurance company then it will cost double for two people, they don't offer deals on "households", and they charge a fortune for women of child bearing age.

900 pounds is still cheap,

413 pounds if your wife isn't working is phenomenally cheap, 413 pounds if you have kids is, welll mind boggling in terms of value.

The fact that you don't pay if you don't earn means the NHS effectively includes an insurance to cover all your health costs if you're benched or your wife is looking after the kids. ....remember your benched and not only do you pay the mortgage you have to fork out over a grand on your health insurance.

I will guarantee if the government were to introduce private health insurance it would drive a lot of contractors with families out of contracting, into the safety of permie jobs offering health insurance.

Contractors would be restricted to the bearded smelly ones without a family who were prepared to fork out of their own pocket to contribute to treatment to get lower premiums.

[NigelJK]

they don't offer deals on "households"

Yes they do. 5 second google search

In the 00's didn't the Conservatives try to win some votes by proposing that you could choose to go private and get a %'age of your NI paid to it?

[VectraMan]

I've often wondered why the Government doesn't offer tax breaks to private companies to introduce private health care for their workers; the NHS could continue to be funded by private taxation but would operate on a smaller and more manageable scale.

Yep. You can make an employer contribution into your employee's pension without any tax, but you can't pay for healthcare without it being a BIK for the employee.

As the government are making every employer join a pension scheme how hard would it be to make every employer also make a healthcare deduction. It wouldn't have to be "private" as in different hospitals, but it could reimburse the NHS for the treatment if you need it.

[unixman]

You can say what you like. The NHS is good value for money. If you want a decent private insurance anywhere in the world it always costs a lot of money.

You won't be able to walz into a private hospital and have your tumour removed for 50 quid.

A private health industry won't offer a fantastic service for next to nothing, private Doctors want to drive around in huge BMW's, and private insurance won't give two hoots about how much your health costs are they'll just shove the premiums up until they make a huge profit. The health insurance industry which is virtually non-existent in the UK will cost billions with thousands of accounts and lawyers all fighting over claims.

Be thankful there's an awful lot of doctors in the UK prepared to work for "peanuts" at least for part of their career.

Contractors paying no NI are saving an absolute fortune. Sure the NHS offers a sloppy service, but it is effing cheap, ...and you don't have to worry about having to pay half of your pension into a health insurance scheme because you're high risk, and if you don't like the sloppy NHS you can dig into your pocket for a reasonably inexpensive medical insurance that supplements a service that is effectively costs nothing for someone not paying NI.

That's unusual. I've never heard anyone argue that the NHS is cheap before. When I Googled "is the NHS cheap", it returned nothing relevant, only a collection of links to NHS discount services, which offer supposedly discounted goods and services to NHS staff.

[BlasterBates]

Yes they do. 5 second google search

And the family deal is no more expensive than a deal for a single person ?

...and you think a "family deal" without any NHS will be 400 quid....?

In any case UK health insurance does not generally cover hospital treatment, perhaps just a contribution, unless you're wealthy it supplements the NHS, do away with the NHS and those UK insurance schemes will be a lot more expensive.

If you did away with the NHS the UK healthy private insurance would change dramatically. Those "family deals" will cost you an arm and a leg.

[BlasterBates]

That's unusual. I've never heard anyone argue that the NHS is cheap before. When I Googled "is the NHS cheap", it returned nothing relevant, only a collection of links to NHS discount services, which offer supposedly discounted goods and services to NHS staff.

NHS 'among best health care systems in the world' - Telegraph

The success of the NHS stands out despite the fact that per capita health spending in the UK is the third lowest of the 11, at £2,170 per head, compared with £3,200 in Switzerland and £4,950 in the US.

[NigelJK]

And the family deal is no more expensive than a deal for a single person ?

Nope, did you think Insurers don't cover families?

[BlasterBates]

Nope, did you think Insurers don't cover families?

No that's not what I meant, of course they cover families.

But what I meant was your premiums increase depending on whether it's for you alone, you and your wife, or you your wife and children.

i.e. you have a big family, and your family deal will cost you an awful lot.

[unixman]

Earlier in this thread I posted the value of my pension, and what income it is likely to give when I retire:

Just got my own pension statement BTW. If I retire now it will pay me 4.5k per annum. I'm 48. Any 48 year old doctor like to declare what their pension is?

Depressingly, that's not a "retire now" figure. It is the projected income if/when I retire at 65. And worse, the stock market has declined since the statement date of Jan 1st, shrinking my fund and the projected income by about 3.2%. And it continues to fall. I'm not looking for pity. Most private sector workers are in the same boat.

On the other hand, public sector pensions have not decreased, because they are "fixed benefit" and thereby insulated from the performance of the economy. Any shortfall is simply picked up by the taxpayer. I believe many NHS staff, perhaps including doctors, do not appreciate this, and do not appreciate the staggering advantage it gives them over the vast majority of the working population. The average NHS staffer will receive 7 to 8k annually after retirement, it seems, as well as a large lump sum. For doctors it varies widely, but this worked example for a GP (perhaps of my age) gives a 6 figure sum on retirement of 115k (!), plus about 38k per year - about 9 times what I can look forward too. And whereas I will work to 65 for my zero lump sum and small pension income, the good doctor can start enjoying his bumper retirement present at 60.

Two thirds of the way down this page, section entitled "worked example": BMA - Pensions - GPs | British Medical Association It is less lavish for newer doctors, this example applies to a GP of perhaps my rough age.

[unixman]

NHS 'among best health care systems in the world' - Telegraph

Well done on highlighting that 4.5 year old Telegraph story. As I say, of all the debates around the NHS, the cost to individuals isn't one you often hear about. I am happy to believe the NHS is reasonable VFM.

Strangely enough, an article in yesterday's Guardian, of all places, was making a convincing case for increased privatisation in the NHS and highlighting some of the ways it performs worse than the insurance models followed in Japan, Europe and the US. Don't shoot the messenger! I was just surprised that the Guardian would print that. I've Googled but can't find it.