Officially pointless to vote UKIP

[d000hg]

You mean a political party that is suggesting the best way forward is to leave an organisation we were never asked whether we wanted to join.
Is going to ask the electorate if that is what they truly want and you see that as a bad thing?

Well they promise to scrap HS2 as well. Are they going to hold a referendum on that?

The whole point of UKIP is leaving the EU. If UKIP get in the people have ALREADY VOTED to leave the EU - a referendum is a waste of time and money. And as already mentioned, what possible use is a UKIP government if a referendum votes "we should stay".

I rather seem to remember we were promised a referendum on Scotland. Oh look, we had one.

It's a pointless discussion because we all know realistically UKIP won't get in to power. In real terms, what use are a handful of UKIP MPs, and a larger number of seats which go LAbour when UKIP split the Tory vote? If you're a UKIP supporter, would you rather see a Tory or Labour PM... those are your only two choices and voting in a way which leads to the 'wrong' one depending how you answer that question is simply cutting off your nose to spite your face... like Labour voters switching to Green.

[d000hg]

We will NOT get a referendum

Of course we will. It's a key differentiator between Tory and Labour policies.

[Avalonia]

of course we won't

[DodgyAgent]

UKIP's manifesto will include a promise to hold an in/out referendum on the EU. So in the fictional universe where they get into power, they could end up governing a nation who vote to remain in the EU anyway. In which case, all of their "fully costed" policies will totally fall apart since they rely on EU savings, and their very raison d'etre is lost.

What a joke. Surely voting UKIP is a vote to leave the EU and their policy should be "we WILL leave the EU".

You might as well vote Tory, that way you still get a referendum but they actually try to fix the relationship first, and have experience running a government.

A no-brainer really. UKIP have massively diluted their position and the best way for EU-skeptics t avoid a Labour-EU love-in is to vote Tory.

It is not all about winning control there are only two parties in the frame for that. The influence of minor parties affects the policies and behaviour of the major parties. You really do not have the intellectual capacity to understand anything beyond black and white do you?

[d000hg]

Good counter-argument.

[Avalonia]

As good as yours

[Euler]

We will NOT get a referendum

Why not?

[d000hg]

It is not all about winning control there are only two parties in the frame for that. The influence of minor parties affects the policies and behaviour of the major parties. You really do not have the intellectual capacity to understand anything beyond black and white do you?

This is kind of my point though, amusingly you couldn't understand it which is ironic considering your sanctimonious tone.

UKIP's presence has effectively forced the Tories to promise a referendum, in which they have made it clear they will urge people to stay in the EU.

But UKIP saying "we'll hold a referendum" not "we WILL leave the EU" means they are not differentiating from the Tories to anywhere near the same degree. You are promised a referendum whether UKIP or Conservative get in.

Except that, voting UKIP reduces the chances of the Conservatives getting in by diluting the Right vote. Therefore, voting UKIP reduces the chance of a referendum being held.

UKIP would have done better towards their aims if they made a deal to get their supporters to vote Tory, in exchange for a referendum.

As a Tory I'd rather have thought you'd be arguing against UKIP...

[Avalonia]

Why not?

Because they might lose.

[vetran]

David Cameron ruled ruled out a coalition with the Lib Dems just prior to forming one. The man is a liar and will not deliver a referendum.

unfortunately this rings true