The dumbing down of the UK

[DodgyAgent]

And they are winning those jobs. Clearly the local "talent" isn't up to the task. And, as I've said before, productivity in the UK is rubbish, and migrants worker faster, harder for the same money. Unless everyone is prepared to be even more ripped off than we already are.

UK workers cannot compete at this level against vastly more qualified people from eastern europe. It is not as if there is actually a shortage in these areas. As for production it seems that ours is low due to a reluctance to invest in technology . people are being employed instead.

[xoggoth]

productivity in the UK is rubbish, and migrants worker faster, harder for the same money

Even if that is true one has to ask a) why? and b) for how long?

If we do have problems in this country like welfare dependency, poor education etc. that damage incentive or ability we need to fix them. Immigration is not going to provide any long term solution as the same problems will affect migrants and their dependents. What do we do then, import yet more migrants? It isn't a solution to an ageing population either, migrants get old too.

[xoggoth]

As for production it seems that ours is low due to a reluctance to invest in technology . people are being employed instead

Quite. We will never compete with the third world by driving down wages, not unless we ditch all our workers' rights and safety procedures as well. Technology is the only way to go. We should be aiming, in every area of the economy, to reduce the need for low skilled and manual workers.

They could start with those overpaid tube drivers.

[darmstadt]

Latest study, Immigration to Britain has not increased unemployment or reduced wages: http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/ea019.pdf

Immigrants, especially in recent years, tend to be younger and better educated than the UK-born and less likely to be unemployed.

...

migrants tend to use fewer public services and be more likely to be in work and paying tax because they were relatively young.

[BlasterBates]

Latest study, Immigration to Britain has not increased unemployment or reduced wages: http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/ea019.pdf

Interesting

There is still no evidence of an overall negative impact of immigration on jobs, wages, housing or crowding out of publice services.

[scooterscot]

Laterally, there's probably a report out there titled 'Germany's brain gain'

[alluvial]

Latest study, Immigration to Britain has not increased unemployment or reduced wages: http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/ea019.pdf

What about if we turn the question around and ask "Has immigration prevented a large reduction in UK unemployment figures and a significant rise in average earnings?"

[BlasterBates]

What about if we turn the question around and ask "Has immigration prevented a large reduction in UK unemployment figures and a significant rise in average earnings?"

Earnings these days are driven pretty much international levels. i.e. if London becomes too expensive they reduce and build up in New York or whereever. I've seen that happen, that they cut bonuses and staff where it's expensive and build up staff where it's cheaper.

The big international companies set average earnings (actually above average) and the smaller companies follow with lower salaries. UK salaries are keeping pace with comparable countries US/Germany and so is unemployment. So the answer to that question is almost certainly not.

Immigration simply means the organisations or parts of organisations are bigger in the UK than they would have been had immigration not taken place. They earn more than they would have done without the immigrants; if you remove the immigrants then they would earn comparably less and so wouldn't be able to pay higher salaries.

Just point out that with unemployment at 5% there's no slack so it isn't that if the immigrants weren't there they would be filled with Brits who are currently twiddling their thumbs. The Brits aren't there to fill those positions.

[alluvial]

Earnings these days are driven pretty much international levels. i.e. if London becomes too expensive they reduce and build up in New York or whereever. I've seen that happen, that they cut bonuses and staff where it's expensive and build up staff where it's cheaper.

The big international companies set average earnings (actually above average) and the smaller companies follow with lower salaries. So the answer to that question is almost certainly not.

So if there's a shortage of potato pickers in East Anglia, they can't increase the wages on offer to coax people off of the dole to come and work for them because their compatriots in New York State don't earn as much?

[DodgyAgent]

It is interesting to see the "tick box" attitude towards immigration from people who see immigrants through a prism that is far detached from some of the realities. Fear and anger in once-wealthy town divided by insecurity and immigration | Society | The Guardian