Lets talk about sex baby

[eek]

The only news here was that some schools haven't been doing it. There is and has been for the last 10 years some very good consistent PSE material for use from reception onwards.

[jjdarg]

Why? It's a question of what is appropriate to the age of the kids. For example, we don't usually detail the horrors of the holocaust to pre-teens.

Pretending that sex doesn't exist and being coy about it to children is, however, stupid.

The article say "age appropriate relationship and sex education". The argument should be focused on what is appropriate - not on whether the kids should receive some kind of education on these matters. The trouble is the phrase "sex education" provokes a knee jerk response in some people. Sex education covers a huge range of topics - some suitable to 5 year olds, some definitely not.

If you look at the organisations that are advising this and previous governments on what is appropriate, then I have a real problem with what is being taught. Brook and Marie Stopes are two organisations that are in the vanguard.

Brook believes that parents should not be told when their children are seeking birth control or other "reproductive services", no matter how young. Marie Stopes has a vested interest in abortion, namely a profit motive (and Marie Stopes - along with her American counterpart - was a eugenicist who felt the "lower" orders and races shouldn't be reproducing).

This is not tinfoil hat, this is fact: Sex Education was invented by communist theorists in the 1920s to help de-bourgeoisie children and break them away from the influence of their family. And this seam still runs through the inheritors in the sex education trade.

My daughter's year 5 class were at a CofE school were shown a film with an animated erection in it. It seems you can show anything in sepia and animation and it is perfectly acceptable - even among so-called evangelicals. The film also admonished year 5 children not to have sex unless they were in a committed relationship. That's fine then.

HTF does 10-year-old know what a committed relationship is? Or a 14-year-old for that matter.

What they are teaching is not biology, it is ideology.

[eek]

If you look at the organisations that are advising this and previous governments on what is appropriate, then I have a real problem with what is being taught. Brook and Marie Stopes are two organisations that are in the vanguard.

Brook believes that parents should not be told when their children are seeking birth control or other "reproductive services", no matter how young. Marie Stopes has a vested interest in abortion, namely a profit motive (and Marie Stopes - along with her American counterpart - was a eugenicist who felt the "lower" orders and races shouldn't be reproducing).

This is not tinfoil hat, this is fact: Sex Education was invented by communist theorists in the 1920s to help de-bourgeoisie children and break them away from the influence of their family. And this seam still runs through the inheritors in the sex education trade.

My daughter's year 5 class were at a CofE school were shown a film with an animated erection in it. It seems you can show anything in sepia and animation and it is perfectly acceptable - even among so-called evangelicals. The film also admonished year 5 children not to have sex unless they were in a committed relationship. That's fine then.

HTF does 10-year-old know what a committed relationship is? Or a 14-year-old for that matter.

What they are teaching is not biology, it is ideology.

Unfortunately there are children who need to know aged 5 what abuse is as they will be abused.

As for committed relationships many of those not abused aged 5 will know what a committed relation is as they will see they parents and know what one is...

[Underscore Pt2]

Sex Education has been in place in Scottish primary schools for years. I was astounded to hear it wasnt in England.

[vetran]

the problem with the Knee Jerk reaction is that its frequently based on experience.

I'm all for telling 5 year olds to report people if they touch their private places, be nice to each other etc. The problem is that some idiot / pervert starts showing them sepia animated hard ons or talking up 'non traditional relationships.

As we already know most of the organised rings were known to the authorities the people who abused their positions of trust weren't properly monitored.

Most of the abuse tends to be people with free access to the kids. Maybe we should first teach parents to spot such things?

why should we rob children of their innocence when they can do sod all to solve the issue and the problem is really ours?

[NotAllThere]

What age is year 5? Been a long time since my kids were at UK school.

[jjdarg]

What age is year 5? Been a long time since my kids were at UK school.

9 and 10.

In fairness to the school (to a point) they did do a pre-screening for parents. It was clear from many of the faces in the room that the other parents were just as uncomfortable with the appropriateness of some of the subject matter as I was, but all it took was a loud-mouthed "liberal" to start saying how "nice" it was and everyone were cowed into submission. No one wants to be seen to be a prude, particularly at the school gate.

Apparently, I "yelled" at the PSHE person when I politely challenged some of the statements in the film.

And the government's guidelines for allowing opt-outs were drafted by Brook, which meant sending a letter (no other method) to the head to opt out, rather than a straight yes/no permission slip. And the opt-out (my daughter) was treated like a pariah when it was shown - the teachers actually told her to tell everyone that she was assigned work when she didn't go to the screening.

Many of her friends were wary of having their own psychological cherries popped (and told her they wished their parents had done the same), but hey, it's for their own good, and we're all modern and forward-thinking.

[NickyBoy]

With children as young as 11 getting pregnant in the UK, opposing sex education at ages 9/10 is foolish to say the least.

To put it plainly, some of our children are having sex at 10. Your 10 year old may have already had sex. This is a hard fact of reality. Your inability to deal with that thought doesn't make it less likely to have happened. Thinking your kid 'isn't like that' doesn't make it less likely to have happened.

Just teaching them that this is too young requires first teaching them, quite clearly, what sex is. Just saying "sex is bad mmmmkay" doesn't really help if the little dears don't realise the fun stuff they are doing with their genitals is sex!

You can do the dumb thing and stick your fingers in your ears going 'lalalalalalala' while telling yourself "my little Timmy isn't doing it" or you can accept reality and allow your children to receive the education necessary to protect and control themselves. A beneficial side effect of this is that your children also pickup the knowledge necessary to know when an adult is doing something wrong with them.

You have a duty to your children that supersedes your discomfort.

[Goatfell]

With children as young as 11 getting pregnant in the UK, opposing sex education at ages 9/10 is foolish to say the least.

To put it plainly, some of our children are having sex at 10. Your 10 year old may have already had sex. This is a hard fact of reality. Your inability to deal with that thought doesn't make it less likely to have happened. Thinking your kid 'isn't like that' doesn't make it less likely to have happened.

Just teaching them that this is too young requires first teaching them, quite clearly, what sex is. Just saying "sex is bad mmmmkay" doesn't really help if the little dears don't realise the fun stuff they are doing with their genitals is sex!

You can do the dumb thing and stick your fingers in your ears going 'lalalalalalala' while telling yourself "my little Timmy isn't doing it" or you can accept reality and allow your children to receive the education necessary teach them how to protect and control themselves. A beneficial side effect of this is that your children also pickup the knowledge necessary to know when an adult is doing something wrong with them.

You have a duty to your children that supersedes your discomfort.

FTFY

[jjdarg]

With children as young as 11 getting pregnant in the UK, opposing sex education at ages 9/10 is foolish to say the least.

To put it plainly, some of our children are having sex at 10. Your 10 year old may have already had sex. This is a hard fact of reality. Your inability to deal with that thought doesn't make it less likely to have happened. Thinking your kid 'isn't like that' doesn't make it less likely to have happened.

Just teaching them that this is too young requires first teaching them, quite clearly, what sex is. Just saying "sex is bad mmmmkay" doesn't really help if the little dears don't realise the fun stuff they are doing with their genitals is sex!

You can do the dumb thing and stick your fingers in your ears going 'lalalalalalala' while telling yourself "my little Timmy isn't doing it" or you can accept reality and allow your children to receive the education necessary to protect and control themselves. A beneficial side effect of this is that your children also pickup the knowledge necessary to know when an adult is doing something wrong with them.

You have a duty to your children that supersedes your discomfort.

You've made a lot of assumptions there about what others think and how they deal with sex in their household.

It is not up to the State to do this, it is up to parents to do it. And getting the State to do it introduces ideology which seeks to be non-judgmental about life choices. Well, life choices have consequences. I didn't see jack-sh** in the video I referred to about the consequences (financially, psychologically, etc.) of starting sex too young.

And because others cannot deal with giving their children values and teaching them the birds and bees does not mean that me and mine have to be strapped in to go along with the state- (and Quango-) sanctioned version of it. There is a lot of money in sex ed, and a lot of ideology in it too, that goes way beyond the birds and bees.