So...anybody ask for any of this?

[DaveB]

I don't think there's anything underhand.

I just think egos are getting in the way of reason.

+1

I also suspect that since the BoD and CC are elected from those that want to do the job and there not many that fall into that category, experience in PR and communications is not always as good as might be expected for an organisation operating in this way.

They have an intelligent and educated membership who recognise political waffle for what it is and won't put up with it. They need to recognise that and modify their approach accordingly.

[tarbera]

+1

I also suspect that since the BoD and CC are elected from those that want to do the job and there not many that fall into that category, experience in PR and communications is not always as good as might be expected for an organisation operating in this way.

They have an intelligent and educated membership who recognise political waffle for what it is and won't put up with it. They need to recognise that and modify their approach accordingly.

Hence why governance is changing this year to address your very concerns

[tractor]

...

Hence why governance is changing this year to address your very concerns

I'll get to that in a bit

[TheFaQQer]

+1

I also suspect that since the BoD and CC are elected from those that want to do the job and there not many that fall into that category, experience in PR and communications is not always as good as might be expected for an organisation operating in this way.

They have an intelligent and educated membership who recognise political waffle for what it is and won't put up with it. They need to recognise that and modify their approach accordingly.

The statement from the Chairman the other day included content from / was written by the professional staff that are employed to communicate better.

That could explain why it gave little detail and lots of words, but to resolve the problems in the past regarding communication, there are professionals employed to do this kind of thing for a living.

[tarbera]

I'll get to that in a bit

When you have time Dear leader

[malvolio]

The thing to remember is the target audience. The Manifesto is aimed at politicians and, to a lesser extent, civil servants. Neither group are particularly savvy of our needs. You won't get a forensic breakdown of the proposal since that is all it is at this stage. When (if) we get to the point where everyone has agreed what it is that's trying to be created, then we can start talking about how it will work. And that's when the level of detail will become important.

As for the IPSE governance changes, they have also not been finalised, so pointless banging on about them until they are. But they are aimed at what IPSE are being told by the CC, the wider membership and external research. They can't take effect until the vote at the AGM in January, so if you have a view, you will be able to have a say.

There's this wonderful perception that IPSE is run by three people sat round a cauldron in a back room somewhere, guarded by a bunch of climenoles. The reality is that it is a very professional organisation with some vey skilled people and very wide-ranging resources to guide it.

[GlenW]

The reality is that it is a very professional organisation with some vey skilled people and very wide-ranging resources to guide it.

and Mr Gilmour

[eek]

The thing to remember is the target audience. The Manifesto is aimed at politicians and, to a lesser extent, civil servants. Neither group are particularly savvy of our needs. You won't get a forensic breakdown of the proposal since that is all it is at this stage. When (if) we get to the point where everyone has agreed what it is that's trying to be created, then we can start talking about how it will work. And that's when the level of detail will become important.

For those of us with experience of how government really works, that is rather scary. A half baked idea will very quickly becoming fully formed as civil servants rapidly fill in any gaps with the things they want....

Giving them an empty idea to expand upon gives them carte blanche to create something you will utterly hate knowing that you can't reject everything in their plan...

[tractor]

...

Fair enough. You don't find the use of fonts and highlighting somewhat erratic?

Please don't read anything into that. In keeping with all message board software that tries to mix rich text with HTML and tags, the IPSE forum is akin to a Tesco shopping trolley when mixing quotes and replies. It has a mind of its own and screws the formatting completely.

It is not Gilmour's fault.

[TykeMerc]

For those of us with experience of how government really works, that is rather scary. A half baked idea will very quickly becoming fully formed as civil servants rapidly fill in any gaps with the things they want....

Giving them an empty idea to expand upon gives them carte blanche to create something you will utterly hate knowing that you can't reject everything in their plan...

Absolutely, this approach simply hands them sufficient rope to hang us all.
The starting position of a negotiation should never be one of total capitulation and the FLC proposal is just that. The Income Tax and NI proposal is just another few feet of rope.