Project Managers - I need your input please

[rurffy]

You cannot see what he does then you go on to make flippant comments about what you think he does.
You are inarticulate and clearly have no idea - basic skills to overcome to be a PM, please do us all a favour and go perm and learn the trade by completing a few projects.

Oops! I think you might be him in disguise . .. Sorry, i didnt mean to hurt your feelings..

Thanks for the advice anyways..

[cojak]

One of the biggest challenges of being a PM is ensuring you have a go-to-guy ( or gal ) who will take on and do all the things that are thrown at you ...... and if you are running a big enough project then believe me you get a lot of stuff hurled at you.

And I am always in contract (and getting extensions) because that is what I actually specialise in, being that go-to-gal and NOT looking at taking the PM's job.

We are rare enough to be taken from project to project by said PMs

[mudskipper]

OK - so im planning to go into the project management sector
I have seen a course at the Open university, link below

M865 - Project management - Open University Course

Anyone taken this course? or do you think Prince2 course is more credible than OU courses?

Did it way back in 1995. I'm assuming it changed a lot since then.

It was useful in terms of PM techniques - contracts, estimating, critical path mapping, resource planning, leadership skills etc, and IIRC, touched on Prince 2 as well. A useful all round introduction for a noob, but probably basic if you've been doing it a while.

If you're already comfortable with the basics, and aren't looking on it as a first step to a postgrad diploma, go for Prince 2.

But as others have said, a PM course (any course) isn't going to get you a PM gig without relevant experience.

[craig1]

As mentioned by mudskipper above, the course is very good if you're a new project manager or wanting to get into it as it actually teaches you techniques of project management. PRINCE2 and PMI are methodology qualifications, they do not teach you how to run a project. I did the M865 course when I started project managing, back when the coursework covered PRINCE not PRINCE2!

So... if you want a CV filler then PRINCE2 as it impresses those who've never run a project, such as agent and HR drones, but don't expect it to teach you how to run a project. If you want to learn project techniques while using the techniques in your current job to pass the course then the OU's M865 is very good, just don't expect it to get you a job.

PRINCE2, APMP, PMI, MSP and the likes are utterly worthless in gauging the quality of a project manager, all it means is that you can read a book and pass an exam, sometimes you have to sit in a room for a week or two and have someone read the book to you before you sit the exam. I suppose to get PMI PMP there is a quality barrier as at least you have to prove you've done the job for a substantial period of time before being allowed to sit the exam. APM used to have the Certificated PM which was a proper qualification but that's gone these days. As long as you remember that these accreditations are money making tools rather than proper certifications then you'll understand why they're so easy to get and why the quality barrier is so low.

[Dallas]

Oops! I think you might be a half decent PM . .. I am jealous..

But I am a desperado going via the back door.

FIFY

[Mephisto]

Don't bother as the market is frigging saturated with PMs and when they can't get a PM or JPM role they 'drop down' to PMO support roles

[craig1]

Thanks ,Lovely response from all, With the numerous response I think I am better off taking the Prince 2 course. I am already on a Team lead contract role working closely with the PM.

And to be honest I don’t see what he does. The only thing is schedule conf appointments, and appointments, and another appointment, and appointments. Then mayb in the end he summarises anything we (technical guys) have said in the meeting.

At the back of my mind - im thinking,…….. hmmm I could do what this bloke(PM) is doing now, give my brain a rest and even earn more. –


In all I think moving purely into PM contract roles with little/no experience is the problem –

Then how do I gain this experience if no is ready to get me on board without prior exp. (Then I think this is where - “going for a lower rate role comes in”)

A perfect project for me is one where everyone is congratulating themselves on an easy project and wondering what I did for the length of the contract.

Protect those inside the project from those outside by ensuring those outside have the right information* to satisfy them and routinely slapping hands of those going directly to your project staff with requests. It puts pressure on me to manage the stakeholders, scope, budget, resources and schedule to the best of my abilities, if I do though then there's no need for people to panic.

My typical week as a project manager is probably split like this:
- 25% stakeholder communications. Get this wrong and you could have a perfect technical project called an abject failure.
- 20% internal two-way status updates from stream leads, tech leads, BAs, testers, PMO, etc. within project. Contrary to what some PMs think, this isn't micromanagement, just going through promised workloads and checking progress against them
- 20% emails, documentation, status reports, etc.
- 15% meetings: team meetings, project meetings, portfolio meetings, sponsor meetings, supplier meetings, etc.
- 5% scope creep slapdowns
- 5% resource and budget management validation, reforecasts and updates
- 10% MBWA

* Note, there's a difference between giving someone the "right information" and giving someone everything in information overload.

[oracleslave]

A perfect project for me is one where everyone is congratulating themselves on an easy project and wondering what I did for the length of the contract.

Protect those inside the project from those outside by ensuring those outside have the right information* to satisfy them and routinely slapping hands of those going directly to your project staff with requests. It puts pressure on me to manage the stakeholders, scope, budget, resources and schedule to the best of my abilities, if I do though then there's no need for people to panic.

My typical week as a project manager is probably split like this:
- 25% stakeholder communications. Get this wrong and you could have a perfect technical project called an abject failure.
- 20% internal two-way status updates from stream leads, tech leads, BAs, testers, PMO, etc. within project. Contrary to what some PMs think, this isn't micromanagement, just going through promised workloads and checking progress against them
- 20% emails, documentation, status reports, etc.
- 15% meetings: team meetings, project meetings, portfolio meetings, sponsor meetings, supplier meetings, etc.
- 5% scope creep slapdowns
- 5% resource and budget management validation, reforecasts and updates
- 10% MBWA

* Note, there's a difference between giving someone the "right information" and giving someone everything in information overload.

Agreed with most of that, particularly the MBWA which is often undervalued. Where are the percentages against:

1) Planning and strategising further out than most are thinking?
2) Fire fighting
3) Contingency planning and constantly looking at what could go wrong (this might just be me :-)
4) I try and dedicate time every week finding people doing something well and thank them. Not in an over the top septic tank manner.

[Project Monkey]

A perfect project for me is one where everyone is congratulating themselves on an easy project and wondering what I did for the length of the contract.

Protect those inside the project from those outside by ensuring those outside have the right information* to satisfy them and routinely slapping hands of those going directly to your project staff with requests. It puts pressure on me to manage the stakeholders, scope, budget, resources and schedule to the best of my abilities, if I do though then there's no need for people to panic.

My typical week as a project manager is probably split like this:
- 25% stakeholder communications. Get this wrong and you could have a perfect technical project called an abject failure.
- 20% internal two-way status updates from stream leads, tech leads, BAs, testers, PMO, etc. within project. Contrary to what some PMs think, this isn't micromanagement, just going through promised workloads and checking progress against them
- 20% emails, documentation, status reports, etc.
- 15% meetings: team meetings, project meetings, portfolio meetings, sponsor meetings, supplier meetings, etc.
- 5% scope creep slapdowns
- 5% resource and budget management validation, reforecasts and updates
- 10% MBWA

* Note, there's a difference between giving someone the "right information" and giving someone everything in information overload.

Yep, 75% of PM time on comms (rule of thumb). Never quote this in interviews though, nobody will believe you.

[craig1]

Agreed with most of that, particularly the MBWA which is often undervalued. Where are the percentages against:

1) Planning and strategising further out than most are thinking?
2) Fire fighting
3) Contingency planning and constantly looking at what could go wrong (this might just be me :-)
4) I try and dedicate time every week finding people doing something well and thank them. Not in an over the top septic tank manner.

I'm a bit of a nightmare for short-term view people in the planning stages of a project. My risk and contingency management planning in that phase is usually quite lengthy! I update 1 and 3 in your list as part of my weekly documentation run, that's why it takes 20% of my time.

On 2, I fit that within the stakeholder management, meetings and MBWA points. I bloody hate firefighting and my personality sees it as a management failure of mine, even if it's something that just couldn't be predicted. I refuse to give it its own headline as, rational or not, that'd be me acknowledging to myself that I'm crap at my job. That said, nearly every project has at least one bit of "oh f***" in it somewhere!

On 4, that's part of MBWA isn't it? It's a seriously underused motivational technique, just saying "thank you" to someone. No need for fancy certificates or embarrassing speeches, just a thank you for a job well done. Most managers wouldn't know how to say "thank you" if you stood and held the door open for them and certainly wouldn't think about saying it for "just doing your job".