Recruitment agents are habitual liars

[NorthWestPerm2Contr]

I have started to lie to estate agencies to give them a bit of their own medicine.

I think we should launch an anti-agency movement where all we do is feed them lies for the next 30 days, like going on strike or something. Then they will learn to be more honest.... or maybe they wont

[EddieNambulous]

I think we should launch an anti-agency movement where all we do is feed them lies

Now, now - no need for extreme measures.

Just remember what Gandhi said:
"An eye for an eye ends up making the whole world blind...but you should still never trust an agent"

[RichardCranium]

To save me posting replies in 9 other threads which are asking about agents' behaviour...

<bump!>

[d000hg]

This should be posted somewhere more prominent than a forum post.

[Stan.goodvibes]

GREAT article. To be honest I have yet to experience the phishing phone call but I'd be tempted to use some of Bart Simpsons joke names...

"Yeah, my boss was a guy called Seymour. Seymour... Butts"

[TheFaQQer]

This should be posted somewhere more prominent than a forum post.

I've added a link in the CUK netiquette thread, since that's a sticky.

For all the good that will do.

[DodgyAgent]

A reminder for the newbies, naïve or forgetful:

Recruitment agents are habitual liars

They don't lie when it is essential, they don't lie when they think it is necessary, they don't lie occasionally, sometimes or frequently. They are so accustomed to lying they do it all the time.

For example, here is a call I had yesterday afternoon. Warning signs and tips are in red.

1. I have had a call from Jimmy Mumble from Mumblymumble Resourcing. If he had had a real role he would have stated his name clearly and quite possibly not his agency name (they really are that egocentric). This test works >90% of the time.


2. He then did NOT say "Is this a convenient time to talk?". They ask this when they have something worth talking about, when phishing they do not care about you as a person and do not ask the question. This test works >80% of the time.


3. Scum: "I've got your CV from AnyOldWhere. You used to work at PreviousClientCo, yes?"

Me: "Yes."

Beware. When told they found you, you are likely to feel head-hunted and flattered. They might not want you, but your knowledge.


4. Scum: "They have a number of roles I am trying to fill and I have seen you have worked there before."

A number of roles means "none, but I'm trying to get a foot in the door". Agents rarely are trying to fill a random selection of different kinds of role. When they are - and it is rare - then they will be loooking to build "an Oracle development team" or "a new in-house testing team" and not "a number of roles". This test works >80% of the time.


5. Scum: "What kind of work did you do at PreviousClientCo?". He has my CV in front of him, FFS, he found me. Is he getting clarification? No, he has not read my CV, he got it from a keyword search on the employer's name and now he is trying to find out what I can tell him about PreviousClientCo. This test works >50% of the time.


6. Me: "I was a Junior Widget Wangler providing fundament cleaning services to Yes Men."

Scum: "So, who were you working with there?" There it is. That's the primary purpose of the call: to get a contact name from you so they can start hassling your old boss, the friendly referee and making that referee hate you in the process. This test is valid > 99% of the time.

In 15 years I have twice had an agent say this question legitimately:
"Who were you working with there, because I placed Fred Bloggs in the manager role, he bought me a bottle of Scotch for placing him, what's he doing now?"
and
"Who were you working with there, because I dealt with a Melanie Frontage and I'd love to know how to get to see her again."
That is two calls out of an estimated 2000 (Ed: and the rest!) discussions with agents.

---> If the agent wants names, there is no point continuing the call. <---

7. Me: "Did you say you were recruiting for them?"

Scum: "Yes."

Now I know he was lying because it was a government site that only uses Catalist for its recruitment and Mumblymumble Recruitment didn't sound like one of those agents.

When at ClientCo, always try to find out who is on their Preferred Supplier List. It often comes in useful later.


8. Me: "There has been a shuffle round since I was working there, it is different managers doing the recruitment now."

Scum: "But can't you give me some names?"

Me: "I could, I know the recruiting managers and the directors plus the decision makers and key business managers, obviously. But as I say, they've had a shuffle round."

Scum: (now wetting himself) "So, who did you work with and what are they doing now?"

Me: "I'm not sure that will help, many have now been promoted to more senior positions or moved sideways, they are doing different things."

Scum: (who has run out of ideas) "So can you tell me who is doing the recruitment?"

Make them squirm. Practise your negotiation skills. They've wasted your time by lying to you, have some fun.

Me: "The people you are already dealing with, of course."

Scum: "Err, oh, of course."

<silence>

<you hear a Ping! as Jimmy Scum remembers his training>


9. Scum: "Can you give me the names, just to make sure they are the same people?"

Use their own silly lies on them. Then they understand what is going on as it is the only language they know.

Me: "Sorry, I can't do that. Data Protection."


10. <click> He realised he was going to get no information from me so he hung up on me.

There was no "number of roles", he was lying. He was using me to get information. Rather than simply tell me the truth he lied. Had he asked me how to get onto their PSL, I would have told him all about Catalist.

Find a way to cope with these liars so you can sleep at night.


11. When you have found that way of coping, please post it on here for my benefit. Thanks.

Bit of a wishy washy view in my opinion.

[TheFaQQer]

Bit of a wishy washy view in my opinion.

Sometimes I wish RC would get off the fence and tell us what he really thinks.

[Spacecadet]

Email from agent 1 about a job using specific and rare tech in a general geographical area
Both tech and area are a good match for me so I apply

Email from agent 2 about a job using specific and rare tech in a specific city which happens to be inside the general area specified by the first agent.

So I call agent 1, ask if her job is in specific city . Get a flat no in response, along with some questions from her about which agency etc....

Anyway, bit of googling around at lunchtime today, and I find a job advert with the exact same words as her email except for the location, which happens to be in the very exact town as specified by agent 2 and which she swore was not related to the job which she "put me forward for"


Although this is balanced out by the agent last week who straight after asking me to send him my CV for a role said:
"I'm not going to put your CV forward"

[BolshieBastard]

Although this is balanced out by the agent last week who straight after asking me to send him my CV for a role said:
"I'm not going to put your CV forward"

What!? An agent actually told you your cv wouldnt be submitted? What astonishing honesty on the agent's part.