I just need to get two references ...

[Brussels Slumdog]

New client contacts

bleet on if they dont get them, but of course they are fishing for new leads ... and in these days of fewer jobs available, its a great way to try and get new client contacts ... .

The main problem based on my past experience is that an agent getting the
name of an interviewing manager by this means has caused me problems.
One agent got hold of an interviewing manager and optained an interview for
me. Now there was a problem as the interviewing manager wanted me to start
ASAP but the HR refused to issue the go ahead as the agent was not on the supplier list.
What would you have done in this situation?
Say no to the contract or reapplied via an approved agent

[Jeebo72]

I've had agents phone me, asking if I would like them to phone my previous employers for me. Of course I said, why would I? I can do that my self! But I'm sure some have said yes in the past.

Never tell an agent anything! Well you know what I mean, and only give out references once a interview has been secured. They do not need them before had. End of.

[Wirefan]

It's amusing reading this board.

I work for an agency, so I am a recruitment swine in your eyes. happy

Unfortunately, the sad fact about our industry is that fat cat recruitment bosses drain the life out of their staff and set them unrealistic new business targets. Some will force recruiters to gain a minimum of 2 references (or leads) per call by sitting on calls with them telling them what to ask. Some agencies don't do this but alot of them do. They are 'trained' in lead generation, in ways that "the 'job seeker' will not suspect". How many of you have had the end of the call Columbo expression? "Oh, just one more thing before you go. Who was it you worked for at x?" I have sat in on many a 'training' session, and I think only the naive ones actually believe they will get anything from it. Fact is, most recruitment consultants hate the new business element of the job and would actually prefer not to do it at all.

Re refs: I do not have any clients who require up front references - I work in defence/aero and even then, the only references you may need are on the security clearance paperwork which most clients request at interview - but this is something you give to the client, not the consultant.
However, that said, I recently worked on a job where we were on a PSL of 4 agencies, and I worked with a contractor who approached me to put a good coversheet together with his CV. What HE suggested, was to give the line manager two references in addition to his CV prior to interview. After we sent the CV, the manager called me personally to ask why we had done this, and I told him that the contractor wanted you to see his references in order to differentiate his CV from the others you are probably looking at. Believe it or not but this actually worked. The manager saw him before the other candidates and subsequently was offered the job and started that week. I know not all scenarios will work the same but just an example that using references is not all about lead gen.

At the end of the day, there will always be poor recruiters, but there are some genuine one's too.
I am probably in the wrong game personally.. I am not a salesman in any way shape or form. I, like most recruiters fell in to the job rather than made it my career. Personally, I would be quite happy simply placing candidates, and not doing any new business activity but we have to accept that we live in a competitive environment, and recruitment agencies will always be looking for new business.

[Grunter]

You cant do that, that is silly. There is a legal requirement for references to be checked

Sorry Dodgy but which law is this?

[DodgyAgent]

Sorry Dodgy but which law is this?

I am not sure. It was a bloke in the pub that told me.

[MrMark]

It's amusing reading this board.

I work for an agency, so I am a recruitment swine in your eyes. happy

Unfortunately, the sad fact about our industry is that fat cat recruitment bosses drain the life out of their staff and set them unrealistic new business targets. Some will force recruiters to gain a minimum of 2 references (or leads) per call by sitting on calls with them telling them what to ask. Some agencies don't do this but alot of them do. They are 'trained' in lead generation, in ways that "the 'job seeker' will not suspect". How many of you have had the end of the call Columbo expression? "Oh, just one more thing before you go. Who was it you worked for at x?" I have sat in on many a 'training' session, and I think only the naive ones actually believe they will get anything from it. Fact is, most recruitment consultants hate the new business element of the job and would actually prefer not to do it at all.

Re refs: I do not have any clients who require up front references - I work in defence/aero and even then, the only references you may need are on the security clearance paperwork which most clients request at interview - but this is something you give to the client, not the consultant.
However, that said, I recently worked on a job where we were on a PSL of 4 agencies, and I worked with a contractor who approached me to put a good coversheet together with his CV. What HE suggested, was to give the line manager two references in addition to his CV prior to interview. After we sent the CV, the manager called me personally to ask why we had done this, and I told him that the contractor wanted you to see his references in order to differentiate his CV from the others you are probably looking at. Believe it or not but this actually worked. The manager saw him before the other candidates and subsequently was offered the job and started that week. I know not all scenarios will work the same but just an example that using references is not all about lead gen.

At the end of the day, there will always be poor recruiters, but there are some genuine one's too.
I am probably in the wrong game personally.. I am not a salesman in any way shape or form. I, like most recruiters fell in to the job rather than made it my career. Personally, I would be quite happy simply placing candidates, and not doing any new business activity but we have to accept that we live in a competitive environment, and recruitment agencies will always be looking for new business.

Thanks for posting that. A lot of us here have learnt to hate certain practises carried out by recruitment agents (be fair, if someone prevented you working and putting food on the table via cv blocking or other tulip, would you feel well-disposed to them?) but it's good to hear a different perspective, and to realise that maybe you're human (at least some of you) after all. Once again, thanks.

[DodgyAgent]

It's amusing reading this board.



Unfortunately, the sad fact about our industry is that fat cat recruitment bosses drain the life out of their staff .

[wiggabaiters]

Does anyone ever get a gig thru Hoaxley? I get bombarded by emails from them about "jobs" that have nothing to do with my skill set whatsoever.

Yes and the beauty of those emails is that even if you unsubscribe you still get them sneaking back in. Ive tagged them to my email provider now as phishing emails. Balls to Huxley! I'm not spending an hour flattering the beggers!

[Punter]

Just got this message:

Dear Punter

Firstly I would like to say, have a great Christmas period and a great holiday!

It is the end of 2009 and 2010 is just around the corner ...

To make sure you are in the best possible position to get a new role in the New Year could I ask you to take 15 minutes just to make sure that we have your up-to-date contact details, CV and referee details.

These details are crucial as they enable us to make contact with you when appropriate roles arise
That we are contacting you about roles that match your current skill set and salary/location aspirations
And that we have up to date references for you.

Please could you forward me your up-to-date CV, a short description of your current situation and please could you fill out the attached short form with your referee details and I will make sure this information is updated for the new year.

Yours sincerely

The form asks for details of 4 referees. Is this a record?

[RichardCranium]

The form asks for details of 4 referees. Is this a record?

Go on, get 4 of your mates to volunteer. You know you want to.