Originally posted by northernladuk
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Contingent Work - Contracts - Temp-to-Perm
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View Post
SC Cleared Solution/Technical Architect. If you are an agency worker you are all suspect to this AWR agreement.
https://www.qdoscontractor.com/tax/g...er-regulations'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!Comment
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Originally posted by northernladuk View Post
You've got to be careful with the terminology about what an agency worker is.
https://www.qdoscontractor.com/tax/g...er-regulationsLast edited by ItsInTheGame; 21 June 2022, 13:43.Comment
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View Post
Yeah, anything Inside IR35 or anyone going through Umbrella or PAYE - 90% of roles out there atm. Not sure what your point is?Comment
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View Post
Yeah, anything Inside IR35 or anyone going through Umbrella or PAYE - 90% of roles out there atm. Not sure what your point is?
I don't agree 90% of roles are inside. I don't believe many people at all get asked to go perm. I rarely see 12 month contracts. AWR has never been a factor in my work.
So just having to dig in to your situation to understand where you are coming from. Nothing you've said even remotely resembles my experience so not sure if you've got a valid point I'm missing or you are not doing the same as most contractors.
I'm not the brightest so could be just me that's a bit confused what you are trying to get to.'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!Comment
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Originally posted by northernladuk View Post
Just trying to understand where you are coming from. It's not until post 6 you mentioned inside and now quoting legislation that only affects Umbrellas yet this isn't in the Umbrella section. Some of the things you are saying don't appear to have any context and I don't agree with them so I'm confused where you are coming from sometimes.
I don't agree 90% of roles are inside. I don't believe many people at all get asked to go perm. I rarely see 12 month contracts. AWR has never been a factor in my work.
So just having to dig in to your situation to understand where you are coming from. Nothing you've said even remotely resembles my experience so not sure if you've got a valid point I'm missing or you are not doing the same as most contractors.
I'm not the brightest so could be just me that's a bit confused what you are trying to get to.
Fair enough - maybe it's me being a little too paranoid.
Example 1 I've had a few job offers over the past few weeks but going through a Employment Resource Model - one for contracting and one for permanent, the contracting one is through a TWA where you are essentially a TWA with them but employed through the Umbrella company. The hiring company has an agreement with the Temp Work Agency as part of the AWR terms that they can offer the TWA a perm contract after a period of time, typically 6 months - clearly the AW can say they are not interested and the original T&C contract either improved, renewed or ended.
Example 2
I've noticed consultancy firms operating fixed term PAYE Employment Resource Models, which is typically a contractor role (agency finds you work/assignments) but they pay you a decent PAYE Salary (The agencies are creaming too much margin) - but the same AWR applies - you are an agency worker and the client / hiring company can offer to take you on perm once your assignment completes.
So essentially, although it may not be crystal clear to the "candidate/employee" you are an AW and suffer from the AWR?
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View Post
Nearly all contract roles are inside IR35, very few are out and even then it's suspect determination.
Not sure if I should encourage my fellow contractors to hold the line or just let the losers lose.
Six months contracts are fine and usually get extended.
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View Post
Fair enough - maybe it's me being a little too paranoid.
Example 1 I've had a few job offers over the past few weeks but going through a Employment Resource Model - one for contracting and one for permanent, the contracting one is through a TWA where you are essentially a TWA with them but employed through the Umbrella company. The hiring company has an agreement with the Temp Work Agency as part of the AWR terms that they can offer the TWA a perm contract after a period of time, typically 6 months - clearly the AW can say they are not interested and the original T&C contract either improved, renewed or ended.
Example 2
I've noticed consultancy firms operating fixed term PAYE Employment Resource Models, which is typically a contractor role (agency finds you work/assignments) but they pay you a decent PAYE Salary (The agencies are creaming too much margin) - but the same AWR applies - you are an agency worker and the client / hiring company can offer to take you on perm once your assignment completes.
So essentially, although it may not be crystal clear to the "candidate/employee" you are an AW and suffer from the AWR?
You must be looking under some very strange rocks.Comment
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Originally posted by ItsInTheGame View PostFair enough - maybe it's me being a little too paranoid.
Example 1 I've had a few job offers over the past few weeks but going through a Employment Resource Model - one for contracting and one for permanent, the contracting one is through a TWA where you are essentially a TWA with them but employed through the Umbrella company. The hiring company has an agreement with the Temp Work Agency as part of the AWR terms that they can offer the TWA a perm contract after a period of time, typically 6 months - clearly the AW can say they are not interested and the original T&C contract either improved, renewed or ended.
So that example isn't a contractor really. It's a glorified onboarding process. As soon as the role description says temp to perm or anything like that you move on. It's not for us.
Example 2
I've noticed consultancy firms operating fixed term PAYE Employment Resource Models, which is typically a contractor role (agency finds you work/assignments) but they pay you a decent PAYE Salary (The agencies are creaming too much margin) - but the same AWR applies - you are an agency worker and the client / hiring company can offer to take you on perm once your assignment completes.
So essentially, although it may not be crystal clear to the "candidate/employee" you are an AW and suffer from the AWR?
But yes, the above happens from time to time. Barclays were using Hyphen to get contractors to work for them and Hyphen hoover up the contracts. Horrible model but it's been going on for years. Fair play to the agencies to trick contractors in to taking the roles, seems a smart move, but again it's not for us. As soon as you get a sniff this is what it is you move on.
Dunno why you are spending so much time worrying about two models that just are not contracting. If it's not a straight forward outside or inside gig where you come in and deliver something and then leave then move on. No point worrying about all this when you aren't going to take them.'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!Comment
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Been working on 6 month contracts for last 15 years, various clients mostly FS
Usually get extended
Current one is 8 months which is unusually long
It's semantics anyway as client can get rid of you (with notice), or not provide work (without notice)Comment
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