New to contracting - Whats a reasonable number of contracted hours?

[mrtuk]

Thanks for all the replies ... a lot of the discussion about prof day vs number of hours I am fully in tune with. My expectation was to be doing a 'professional day', but my interpretation of this was an 'average' day of 8 hours (say 9-6 with an hour for lunch), but being there to deliver a 'service' rather than a number of hours, so there would be occasions where i'd need to work later/at home etc to deliver that service, so 10 (or more) hours some days as required.

The wording on the schedule of the contract says the 'contract basis' is:
- Service hours 50 per week, being the estimated number of hours initially agreed as required fro delivery of the Company Services per week in order to meet the Requirements.
- Professional Day 10 hours (being the estimated number of hours per day for completion of the Requirements within the Contract Term) or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Requirements.
- Additional Hours: Any hours other than the service hours worked by the Company and approved by the client where the requirements necessitate work in addition to estimated work.

.. So i read this as them expecting the contract to require a min of 10 hours per day but could be more if required. .... so beginning to wonder if this would be a red flag to anyone?

[eek]

10 hours a day - sorry but I'm going to keep this bench warm - find some other mug...

[psychocandy]

If they've put 10 hours a day then I'd say that is the expectation. Do less than this and someone will notice.

Not for me in a million years. Even if the rate is phenomenal. I've got other things going on like living.

IMHO 11-12 hours a day inc travel is about max on a regular basis. More than that and your going to kill yourself, get divorced, have your kids knowing the postman better.
My current gig is this and its tough at times.

[MrMarkyMark]

10 hours a day - sorry but I'm going to keep this bench warm - find some other mug...

Exactly, Malvolio seems to see no issue with this.

I certainly wouldn't expect it, especially if my point of reference for negotiations was a professional 8 hour day.
Seems they could have you working almost all the hours God sends.

[malvolio]

Exactly, Malvolio seems to see no issue with this.

I certainly wouldn't expect it, especially if my point of reference for negotiations was a professional 8 hour day.
Seems they could have you working almost all the hours God sends.

Please go back and read what I said properly. The contract wording is trying, in a ham-fisted way, to define the upper limit of the PWD, not its minimum.

[Lance]

Thanks for all the replies ... a lot of the discussion about prof day vs number of hours I am fully in tune with. My expectation was to be doing a 'professional day', but my interpretation of this was an 'average' day of 8 hours (say 9-6 with an hour for lunch), but being there to deliver a 'service' rather than a number of hours, so there would be occasions where i'd need to work later/at home etc to deliver that service, so 10 (or more) hours some days as required.

The wording on the schedule of the contract says the 'contract basis' is:
- Service hours 50 per week, being the estimated number of hours initially agreed as required fro delivery of the Company Services per week in order to meet the Requirements.
- Professional Day 10 hours (being the estimated number of hours per day for completion of the Requirements within the Contract Term) or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Requirements.
- Additional Hours: Any hours other than the service hours worked by the Company and approved by the client where the requirements necessitate work in addition to estimated work.

.. So i read this as them expecting the contract to require a min of 10 hours per day but could be more if required. .... so beginning to wonder if this would be a red flag to anyone?

You could simply agree to it. And immediately enforce your right of substitution and put 2 people on the job (neither of whom have agreed to opt out of the working-time directive).

[MrMarkyMark]

Please go back and read what I said properly. The contract wording is trying, in a ham-fisted way, to define the upper limit of the PWD, not its minimum.

I did read it properly.

I just didn't agree with your view and I wouldn't be signing the contract.
The point is you think it is that way, you don't know it would be that way and TBF I don't know either.

[malvolio]

I did read it properly.

I just didn't agree with your view and I wouldn't be signing the contract.
The point is you think it is that way, you don't know it would be that way and TBF I don't know either.

And nor does the OP who seems determined not to find out...

[eek]

Well as its Malvolio I'll waste a few seconds going through the contract line by line

Service hours 50 per week, being the estimated number of hours initially agreed as required fro delivery of the Company Services per week in order to meet the Requirements.

You are agreeing to work 50 hours a week

- Professional Day 10 hours (being the estimated number of hours per day for completion of the Requirements within the Contract Term) or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Requirements.

10 hours unless the client requests less (and somehow I doubt they will)

- Additional Hours: Any hours other than the service hours worked by the Company and approved by the client where the requirements necessitate work in addition to estimated work.

At least hours beyond 50 appear to be billable separately although that's not 100% clear.

Now which part of this contract does not seem to expect you to work 50 hours a week am I missing that makes this contract acceptable (it reads like something an indian outsource gives their onshored staff on pain of being fired without a flight home.)

[sal]

That's why to avoid similar situations I usually ask about the normal working hours during the interview with the client. Also ask about planned weekend and evenings work, so there are no surprises later. Based on the info I decide if the working times are acceptable and/or require some re-negotiation of the rate with the agent.

If later there are discrepancies between what i was told by the client and the contract i would question it with the agent based on my conversation with the client. In some situations I might be happy with signing a contract that states more hours, if confident enough that the client is actually looking for less and is happy to sign my timesheets for say 12h day if i'm only onsite for 8-9h. There is a certain risk in such cases, but it all depends.